Length MSQ from all the expansions - it is getting insane

[VelKallor]

So why are you drawing wild, unsubstantiated and in fact UNPROVEABLE conclusions on player retention when you dont have any accurate data? You dont know. Those three words may be very hard for you to admit, but its the truth.

You dont know. I dont have an issue with those three words...evidently you do.

, so yall keep rambling about this "yeah steam numbers are not good enough !!!" "they dont cover enough people",

No, they dont. You have admitted as much, so why are you staunchly hanging onto what is essentially a GIGO result?

and the only reason why this comes up is because you know very well that they wont ever post these

Correct. So, unlike you, I wont be making any false or misleading assumptions based on data I dont have. Aside from my own, albeit anecdotal observations, I have no idea which way things are going.

You, however, seem to set a lot of stock in these so called "perceptions", Id almost call it confirmation bias to a degree. You are jaded, cynical, at times contemptuous towards others who are enjoying the game, as you seem to want to think that the game is bad and they should think as you do...why is that?

, so you can keep denying any sort of criticism that people have towards the game and act like everything is good and dandy and the game is in a perfectly good state and is not losing players.

Yet I cant find anyone who has said this. Not in this thread, in any case..I certainly havent, despite the fact you keep trying to put words in my mouth.

As far as I am concerned I am having a blast, currently crafting a Coelacanth - class submarine...actually that name made me smile. The Coelacanth was supposed to have been extinct for millennia..until they started turning up in fishermans nets.

Stormpeaks, we dont know , we may never know the exact state of play, you dont have that data, neither do I. So why draw these silly hypotheses as fact when you dont have reliable, sourced and proveable data? STEAM data on its own is NOT sufficient, nor is it in any way an identifiable or viable metric to gauge any supposed 'trends".

Ill say this again, as it seems you have elided over my previous thread comments. No game is perfect, none will ever be so. There will always be flaws, issues, thats a given in game developement.

Is FF 14 fun for me? Yes.

Do I consider the story a masterpiece? Based on my own reading over the years and other games I have played? Yes.

You seem to take odd delight in telling others how bad the game is and its losing players blah blah....why?

Im at a loss to understand exactly WHAT it is you are trying to say here.

[Shinkuno]

So why are you drawing wild, unsubstantiated and in fact UNPROVEABLE conclusions on player retention when you dont have any accurate data? You dont know. Those three words may be very hard for you to admit, but its the truth.

Ah yes, the data that developers in the past have claimed is very indicative of playerbase, path of exile developer grinding gear games still citing them in their league wrapups, is somehow in FF14 not accurate enough because it goes against your beliefs of a ever growing masterpiece of a game. Must be an easy life to live when you just deny reality 24/7

[Saraide]

Steam charts is accurate data. You'd have to prove that steam users are significantely different than console and standalone users. What's the reason to assume this? Anectodal evidence does not count. You dont need all the data, you just need a representative sample to draw valid conclusions.

[Stormpeaks]

Steam charts is accurate data. You'd have to prove that steam users are significantely different than console and standalone users. What's the reason to assume this? Anectodal evidence does not count. You dont need all the data, you just need a representative sample to draw valid conclusions.

^ this basically. Except if you can prove that people on different platforms do entirely different content

Ah yes, the data that developers in the past have claimed is very indicative of playerbase, path of exile developer grinding gear games still citing them in their league wrapups, is somehow in FF14 not accurate enough because it goes against your beliefs of a ever growing masterpiece of a game. Must be an easy life to live when you just deny reality 24/7

And this ^

[Striker44]

Steam charts is accurate data. You'd have to prove that steam users are significantely different than console and standalone users. What's the reason to assume this? Anectodal evidence does not count. You dont need all the data, you just need a representative sample to draw valid conclusions.

Actually, if you're the one making the claim, the impetus is on you to prove that Steam users are actually similar to console and SE launcher users. None of our anecdotal evidence is sufficient, as we've all mentioned. YOU need to show that the data is actually representative of the larger playerbase and usable for conclusions before it becomes valid.

[Stormpeaks]

Actually, if you're the one making the claim, the impetus is on you to prove that Steam users are actually similar to console and SE launcher users. None of our anecdotal evidence is sufficient, as we've all mentioned. YOU need to show that the data is actually representative of the larger playerbase and usable for conclusions before it becomes valid.

Or just be logical that the person behind the screen is the same, be it on console or computer, everyone in this game does multiple activities.

[Saraide]

Actually, if you're the one making the claim, the impetus is on you to prove that Steam users are actually similar to console and SE launcher users. None of our anecdotal evidence is sufficient, as we've all mentioned. YOU need to show that the data is actually representative of the larger playerbase and usable for conclusions before it becomes valid.

Do you have reasons to assume steam users are different? I cant really think of one.

[VeyaAkemi]

Do you have reasons to assume steam users are different? I cant really think of one.

Actually I can give one: Different nationalities, no seriously, let me explain, Steam provides a fixed rate on subscriptions, no matter the exchange rate for your country's currency, you will always pay the same, and in my case, I am from Brazil you see, it's substantially cheaper than paying it directly, this means that Brazilian players are substantially more encouraged to be Steam players, where as for an American player, playing through Steam might actually be a detriment since it provides no real benefit.

I am not saying I agree with their point, rather that there are externuating circumstances that can lead to vastly different demographics(and thus different perspectives) to play through Steam or standalone, and those circumstances might not be immediately obvious unless you are part of it.

[Boblawblah]

Actually, if you're the one making the claim, the impetus is on you to prove that Steam users are actually similar to console and SE launcher users. None of our anecdotal evidence is sufficient, as we've all mentioned. YOU need to show that the data is actually representative of the larger playerbase and usable for conclusions before it becomes valid.

That's simply not true. They don't have to prove anything for Steam to be a representative sample of FFXIV players. It either is or is isn't. Whether or not you choose to give it any weight is another question. You've already decided that nothing can change your opinion, and that's fine, there's nothing short of Yoshi-P walking up to you and saying "Hey, actually we notice the Steam population trends follow the global population trends". hell, even then I have a feeling you'd say "hmm, who put you up to this?"

[Zanarkand-Ronso]

there's nothing short of Yoshi-P walking up to you and saying "Hey, actually we notice the Steam population trends follow the global population trends".

I mean.....did he?