Should XIV add more end game combat content.

[Kosachi]

they need to take focus more off making Ultimates and the likes of that and focus more on casual content that the remaining 99% actually would do.

Can we please PLEASE stop acting like ultimates are a boogeyman who are sucking the life out of the devs. We get two of these per expansion if we're lucky so not like it's keeping them up all day and all night crunching.

Also this 1% BS is the silliest strawman and I'm getting tired of it. 12% of players have actually cleared uwu and 8% of players have cleared tea. (Source: https://ffxivcollect.com/titles?q%5B...cont%5D=legend) and these are just from titles so it doesn't count people who aren't wearing it. At the end of the day though, clear rates don't even matter that much. What matters most is that people attempt them and that number is without a doubt a lot higher.

Finally, raiders aren't the ones who are advocating for taking content away from other people. I personally enjoy just playing the game for the sake of playing the game and so a lot of "casual" things the games have to offer are rather enjoyable. And if a raider doesn't feel like doing it, they play something else. It's the "Casuals" who are advocating for removing a large and historic part of the game because they selfishly think it will give them more content because they're the not the minority.

[Gember]

I think the endgame is fine.

What I would prefer the devs would do is tighten the ilvl for normal content so people are not steamrolling through it. (Thordan being the most best example here.)

[NekoMataMata]

Obviously they should. Seriously, look at SB, HW, and ARR. There's so many extra non-MSQ dungeons from those eras at their respective endgames. Meanwhile EW has two extra dungeons at level 90 that aren't MSQ.

[Derio]

Criterion was the answer to that but the rewards were so terrible that it became a one time thing if even that. In SHB we had bozja as an entire endgame zone that had multiple content, duels, 2 raids, fates with varying boss fights and was used as inbetween savage patches.

In Endwalker we do not have that. Which is why most people feel this expansion is lacking something. If Criterion and deep dungeon were more successful we wouldnt have threads like this.

[NekoMataMata]

Can we please PLEASE stop acting like ultimates are a boogeyman who are sucking the life out of the devs. We get two of these per expansion if we're lucky so not like it's keeping them up all day and all night crunching.

Also this 1% BS is the silliest strawman and I'm getting tired of it. 12% of players have actually cleared uwu and 8% of players have cleared tea. (Source: https://ffxivcollect.com/titles?q%5B...cont%5D=legend) and these are just from titles so it doesn't count people who aren't wearing it. At the end of the day though, clear rates don't even matter that much. What matters most is that people attempt them and that number is without a doubt a lot higher.

Finally, raiders aren't the ones who are advocating for taking content away from other people. I personally enjoy just playing the game for the sake of playing the game and so a lot of "casual" things the games have to offer are rather enjoyable. And if a raider doesn't feel like doing it, they play something else. It's the "Casuals" who are advocating for removing a large and historic part of the game because they selfishly think it will give them more content because they're the not the minority.

So I'm not a statistics expert or anything, but when you use the clear rates from UWU and TEA as examples do you consider that it's an estimate provided for the entire playerbase of content that was created 4-5 years ago? UCoB which is even older is sitting at 7.4% as well.

The clear rates of older ultimates are probably going to go up over time, but I don't believe that means the clear rate is representative of active players.

Oh and FFXIV Collect grabs data from anyone with their lodestone page set to public. I don't believe there's that many people with their pages set to private. It doesn't care about whether or not the person is wearing/wears their title. The moment the achievement is earned Collect logs it.

So. Based on that let's be generous and give UWU +3% clears that we don't know about. Let's go on and double that to account for the people attempting but not clearing as well. That's 30% activity. You are still in the minority by a lot, and that's being incredibly generous. I get that the whole "only 1% of the player base bothers with ultimates" is a massive exaggeration, but it doesn't change the fact that only a minority of the player base does in fact bother engaging with ultimates.

30% of the total player base with a very, very generous estimation. Not the active player base that plays through the post expansion patches, just the total player base.

Anyways, continue on.

[Sotaris]

Depends on what we'll get as "endgame". Are we talking about challenging content like Ultimates and Savage and Extreme? Some people will ofc debate on if the latter is challenging.

Personally, I'm far from the target audience for several expansions. I'm more into the casual stuff like socializing with my FC, crafting/gathering, and doing roulettes for tomes these days.

But I know there is a player base that are requesting more, so if they can find a happy balance, go for it.

[TomsYoungerBro]

Endgame needs midcore content. In the middle thats harder than the normal duty content but is easier than EX. Ultima unreal (while being a former EX scaled up) was a good concept for a difficulty level of midcore content. Just a few simple mechs and a dps check that is easily doable even with multiple deaths, but is dangerous enough to still wipe you or hit enrage if you corpse drag a little too hard. Its literally been the only current PF content ive done where i never had to put [duty complete] to get a good experience clearing it twice a week. Parties filled super fast at any point in the week.

[Kansene]

Obviously they should. Seriously, look at SB, HW, and ARR. There's so many extra non-MSQ dungeons from those eras at their respective endgames. Meanwhile EW has two extra dungeons at level 90 that aren't MSQ.

Unless they change up how dungeons work I won't really be hyped about extra ones. It's nice to see new boss mechanics, but everything leading up to bosses in every dungeon is so samey that I'd rather see something else.

[Kosachi]

So I'm not a statistics expert or anything, but when you use the clear rates from UWU and TEA as examples do you consider that it's an estimate provided for the entire playerbase of content that was created 4-5 years ago? UCoB which is even older is sitting at 7.4% as well.

The clear rates of older ultimates are probably going to go up over time, but I don't believe that means the clear rate is representative of active players.

Oh and FFXIV Collect grabs data from anyone with their lodestone page set to public. I don't believe there's that many people with their pages set to private. It doesn't care about whether or not the person is wearing/wears their title. The moment the achievement is earned Collect logs it.

So. Based on that let's be generous and give UWU +3% clears that we don't know about. Let's go on and double that to account for the people attempting but not clearing as well. That's 30% activity. You are still in the minority by a lot, and that's being incredibly generous. I get that the whole "only 1% of the player base bothers with ultimates" is a massive exaggeration, but it doesn't change the fact that only a minority of the player base does in fact bother engaging with ultimates.

30% of the total player base with a very, very generous estimation. Not the active player base that plays through the post expansion patches, just the total player base.

Anyways, continue on.

Im not arguing that ultimate raiders are the majority. What I am saying is that there's enough people out there who enjoy the content to merit its existence.

The whole majority/minority argument is completely stupid to begin with.

One: You can make any community to be a extreme minority just by cutting it down. like: "Only 1% of players have a house. We should scrap housing" or "Only 1% of players go to older zones, we should scrap them" (I know this is not accurate, just making a point) As long as people enjoy and cherish content, that is enough for it to exist.

Two: 30% isn't a majority but it's bloody huge. More than enough to merit it not getting scrapped??????????? Do you need a majority of people for something to exist?

[Avoidy]

Virtually every F2P mmo I played, even the ones with zombie populations and skeleton crews, managed to have more engagement during content lulls and more regular content updates than this game. I have no idea why anyone defends being billed monthly while receiving relevant content every 4 months (every 9 if you don't care about savage). Would it really be so hard to just... utilize existing systems to keep people interested during the lulls? How about a moogle tomestone event once a month instead of whatever the hell this current setup is. How about just uncapping the tomes so people who want to grind can grind. How about uncapping the weekly gear shit too. How about... taking the unreal system, and applying it to more than just 1 old trial nobody's cared about in a decade? Or taking things like... criterion, where the primary critique is that the rewards are trash, and upgrading the rewards so people want to do it???

Imagine being a developer for a successful mmo. Your player base are already hooked on your product. Their main issue with your game is that they want shit to do. And you... implement arbitrary caps and limits to force them to play less??? Why? You don't even need to make new content; just get out of the way.