FFXIV Job Design Feedback

[fulminating]

Part of it for me is that there's no mix-up of the PVE content. How dungeons/raids/trials were at the start of the expansion it will still be at the end 2.5 years after launch.

While Eureka had its issues, the way you went into it was different with the fate trains, and the actions from Pyros put another layer on it. Same for Bozja with the actions from the start and the "dungeons" being a bit of a different approach.

EW doesn't feel like it has this different approach, the closest is DD-Eureka, but it's very similar to PD/HoH. This could be the PVE content where they experimented a bit, don't need to be a full remake like PVP, but perhaps add some layers like upgradeable abilities (SAM's third Eye can be upgraded to the PVP parry version, RPR's Shadow of Death can be upgraded to Death Warrant) or bring back some old abilities that were removed. The big thing they could also add are the personal PVP limitbreaks (although some would need a bit of a change). This could create a new way for the combat system to function without interfering with normal balance in dungeons/raids/trials.

Variant actions or whatever they're called also seem pretty wasted in terms of potential, they could have built on what came before in eureka and StQ, but there's hardly any options there. Mias-I'm sorry, Variant spirit dart hardly compares to lost blood rage or lost seraph strike or even messing around with focus stacks.

[Rein_eon_Osborne]

Just wanna add few of my gil too, that job design might’ve been so stale because their team is so undermanned since forever.

Job count keeps going up as expansions after expansions being added, but the # of job designer stays constant. Those limited brainpower will inevitably run out of juicy, new ideas way faster.

[CelestiCer]

I guess my post got removed because it's viewed as harmful? Are the once reading this... actually dense enough to not know meme's xD? Or actually you might not even play the game I guess.






Explanation: The Samurai skill " Kaiten " got removed as a Kenki spender, it's OGCD. Wait you might know what OGCD means okey so... Off Global Cooldown taht you can press in between your rotation so that's called weaving... that probably also doesn't make sense... Its a fun button okey view it that way. Now Square removed it. And you can only press in between your skill rotation? so many meaningful buttons now. So instead of Kaiten all we do is " Shinten " Spamming, meaning that's all we press? that makes the gameplay or on Topic? Job Design, dumber.

Thus the meme in the picture? is that all we do is
Shinten Shinten Shinten etc, Because that has become the Job design the picture is the Shinten Icon. Get it?

[Nizzi]

So I thought of an interesting question that could be fun to discuss. There's no need to get very specific with these ideas, but start by picking a job. What are 1-5 actions you want to see added to that job in the next expansion (regardless of whether or not you believe they're realistic), and what are 1-5 actions you expect to see of that same job?

This kind of stuff is fun even if it doesn't result in anything from SE, but work is boring today so I may as well!

For Scholar...

What I want to see

• Miasma and Miasma II's restoration, but slightly reworked. I think BRD's DoTs are going to be culled in 7.0, and I thought the previous gameplay they had was very fun, so ideally I'd like for that to be incorporated into SCH's gameplay loop somehow; leaning into SCH's crit buff a bit, a crit tick from Bio or Miasma would give the ability to use Miasma II (can replace either Art of War or Ruin II to not have a dedicated conditional button) which would be DPS neutral or a DPS gain in ST encounters (I was thinking 200-250 potency + 12s 25 potency DoT vs Broil's 295) but having the "Miasma II ready" or whatever effect on a short timer so you can't just hold it for burst windows and instead use it for needed movement within the timer duration or just immediately.
• Bane either as its own button or a trait of Deployment Tactics, spreads Miasma and Bio
• Adlo to become an upgrade of Physick
• Protraction to become spreadable via Deployment Tactics

What I expect

• Broil V, Biolysis II
• A 2nd charge of Indom or Fey Blessing
• Trait that reduces the recast timer of Summon Seraph
• Level 100 skill being some oGCD heal+shield that invalidates Indom being used for 90% of things, just like Excog invalidates Lustrate very heavily.

I guess this could also go under "What I want to see" but this is more of a general change; since they're adding fairy glamour and likely removing Summon Selene as a button, just go all the way and make the fairy upgrade into Seraph at level 80 so we can virtually eliminate the remaining ghosting too. Would give a paint job to Whispering Dawn and Fey Illumination while also not locking you out of Fey Blessing, Dissipation or Fey Union. Change "Summon Seraph" into Rouse to get the buffed Embraces + Consolation and there's significantly less "clunk" present too.

[ForsakenRoe]

Variant actions or whatever they're called also seem pretty wasted in terms of potential, they could have built on what came before in eureka and StQ, but there's hardly any options there. Mias-I'm sorry, Variant spirit dart hardly compares to lost blood rage or lost seraph strike or even messing around with focus stacks.

Still remember people pogging out of their gourd about how it was '2040 potency per tick thats so strong doood' not realizing it's PVP style where it's 1:1, that was depressing

I have said for a while that exploratory content like Bozja is where they can and should go nuts. Like as an example, why is the special armor in Eureka 'lol flat stat buff' and a bit of haste? Why is the Bozja armor 'haste again'? Why can't we have bizarre and interesting stuff like 'Oh you are a GNB and you have 2/5 pieces of the set equipped? Ok, now your No Mercy lasts 25s instead of 20s. You have 4/5 set? Okay, now you can use Hypervelocity after a Double Down AND Sonic Break, as well as Burst Strike'? Just let everyone have wacky OP effects because they're selfcontained, and if everyone is OP then nobody is

[Kisshu]

Still remember people pogging out of their gourd about how it was '2040 potency per tick thats so strong doood' not realizing it's PVP style where it's 1:1, that was depressing

I have said for a while that exploratory content like Bozja is where they can and should go nuts. Like as an example, why is the special armor in Eureka 'lol flat stat buff' and a bit of haste? Why is the Bozja armor 'haste again'? Why can't we have bizarre and interesting stuff like 'Oh you are a GNB and you have 2/5 pieces of the set equipped? Ok, now your No Mercy lasts 25s instead of 20s. You have 4/5 set? Okay, now you can use Hypervelocity after a Double Down AND Sonic Break, as well as Burst Strike'? Just let everyone have wacky OP effects because they're selfcontained, and if everyone is OP then nobody is

This is honestly my dream side-content. Been brewing on an idea of a monster hunter island with forced-spawned bosses that drop gear. This gear will then enhance (say make Barrage hit four times), modify (AoE Esuna, Blood Weapon cost HP per hit but gains a big damage boost) or add new abilities/traits to jobs (a ring that gives mages Divine Magic Mastery for half cost spells and no interruption).

Some side content that is self contained so it doesn't upset the balance, but is more experimental and open.

[Havenchild]

Judging by the responses I've seen on SCH, and the other healers, pretty sure people are aiming to kill healers in PF, more dead than current. People just don't seem to comprehend how much you can safely add to the jobs without pushing people off the job (that currently play it).

So there's that.

But one thing I was happy to see was that everyone in SCH survey seemed to agreed that the Fairy needs some work, particularly the Fairy's queing, and its lack of functionaility with Seraph, the fairie guage, and Dissipation. Even if you were being conservative with job changes, at the very least that really needs to be examined.

[fulminating]

Judging by the responses I've seen on SCH, and the other healers, pretty sure people are aiming to kill healers in PF, more dead than current. People just don't seem to comprehend how much you can safely add to the jobs without pushing people off the job (that currently play it).
.

The healing kits are bloated, the dps anaemic. No other role punishes you for improving and why should they? Healing requirements in casual content cannot be increased because little hypothetical Timmy already relies on the warrior doing the bulk of the work, so it falls to consolidating the superfluous healing actions and fleshing out the downtime side. SE of all people should know just how much of the fights are incoming damage, every encounter ticks along like clockwork after all.

[Sparkthor]

I have said for a while that exploratory content like Bozja is where they can and should go nuts. Like as an example, why is the special armor in Eureka 'lol flat stat buff' and a bit of haste? Why is the Bozja armor 'haste again'? Why can't we have bizarre and interesting stuff like 'Oh you are a GNB and you have 2/5 pieces of the set equipped? Ok, now your No Mercy lasts 25s instead of 20s. You have 4/5 set? Okay, now you can use Hypervelocity after a Double Down AND Sonic Break, as well as Burst Strike'? Just let everyone have wacky OP effects because they're selfcontained, and if everyone is OP then nobody is

Probably because there is no current link between stuff and abilities in code and they don't want to create something like this for a stuff only few people will ever get.

I don't think they wanna implement this at some point : due to stuff differences are only in substat if they got the same ilvl, any changes in ability behaviour would go on base ability instead of some stuff.

[ty_taurus]

I thought I'd drop this here as well. This is a video of Xenosys Vex talking about the lack of change going from Shadowbringers to Endwalker. I'm not always a fan of how he talks about certain topics, but I think there's a lot of truth in the way he talked about the problems that EW has, also noting that EW isn't entirely bad, but the lack of risk-taking has made the expansion feel stale, and this was 10 months ago.

It's a little long, but a good watch. And I agree with the main point that there should be more risk-taking with job design in an expansion. EW was an opportunity to try something different, but that opportunity wasn't taken. I think the pressure for 7.0 to do the same will be greater this time around.