Why do people avoid getting better at the game?

[Kolaina]

And I gonna maintain my opinion the reasons the 2.0 early trial were perceived as difficulty were because how fresh the player base then.

2.0 trial? Fresh player base? TP was around beyond ARR. the other changes I mentioned were done more recently. The overall player skill level has diminished and you’re defending mediocrity while initially trying to suggest by “the game you walked into” as if the bar was always set so low. Time for you to be real.

[VelKallor]

After all, people play their game to make them happy, not making you happy.

Sssshhh...dont use common sense..you'll just confuse him

[Shinkuno]

Sssshhh...dont use common sense..you'll just confuse him

then maybe dont play a multiplayer game? especially not one that has a ToS Clause that says if the majority of your group doesnt like what you do, you can get the boot

[Melorie]

I honestly don't consider the people that afk on limsa everyday and feel entitled to every single reward with barebones participation are casuals. Casual players are people that don't give a lot of hours to the game and that don't engage in a lot of endgame activities like savage or ultimate, not players that stay subbed and online everyday but have zero interest in any gameplay or learning curve. That is an entirely different crowd. Like these people breath FFXIV, barely play other games, even raiders that log in two days a week are more casual than them.

That being said, I feel like someone being bad in a group making your life miserable is sort of dramatic.

IMO while we have more and more people that are simply lazy to commit any time at all to something, the game gives you zero reason to actually feel like you have to learn your class.

First of all, most classes feels barebones if you are not at the level cap and there is few or next to nothing repeatable daily content where you are actually at level 90.

Most content normal content can be cleared without asking for your full kit.

Without third party tools you actually have NOTHING to tell you if you are doing it right or wrong, if you are being able to do a good amount of damage or not, so many people do not even realize they are terrible.

And lastly, getting better at your class is not an exciting journey in this game. You rarely feel like you are making a difference by being good, there is only so much you can do, and once you are "good" there is... nowhere to go, really. You can't put your twist, you can't customize, you can't find your way of doing something. So most people lose interest.

In general, the game rarely strikes your curiosity... You can keep on being mediocre and unless you are curious and go for that information, nothing you make you sparkle "hey, how should I be doing x?".
So yeah, I don't really blame people for not even trying to be better at the game because being better makes no difference. It makes no difference to your gameplay, to the fight you are doing, to the way you use your class.

[VelKallor]

I honestly don't consider the people that afk on limsa everyday and feel entitled to every single reward with barebones participation are casuals.

Exactly how these two things are even related or coexist in any form is yet to be proven.

Casual players are people that don't give a lot of hours to the game and that don't engage in a lot of endgame activities like savage or ultimate

Endgame is whatever we want it to be...FF 14 isnt raid or die, nor is it in anyway raid reliant or dependant, your determination of 'worth" based on who raids is basically...idiotic.

not players that stay subbed and online everyday but have zero interest in any gameplay or learning curve

What gameplay in specific?

Without third party tools you actually have NOTHING to tell you if you are doing it right or wrong, if you are being able to do a good amount of damage or not, so many people do not even realize they are terrible.

The game is playable and clearable without third party tools...your reliance on these is a YOU problem.

[Melorie]

Endgame is whatever we want it to be...FF 14 isnt raid or die, nor is it in anyway raid reliant or dependant, your determination of 'worth" based on who raids is basically...idiotic.



The game is playable and clearable without third party tools...your reliance on these is a YOU problem.

That's why I said "like savage or ultimate". I never said that a person isn't worth because they do not raid, that is your own insecurities regarding raiding that shows every single thread speaking. I spend most of my time fishing lately... But regardless, it is not uncommon to act like endgame is the hardest content available in a game with a progression/content such as FFXIV, so I'm not sure why you are surprised with that statement, it is not like it is a sandbox game.

I also literally told you how you can clear most of the game without ever knowing if you are optimizing your class or not, so still, you proved my point yet again. Fact remains that there is no system in-game to actually tell you if you are pushing your class to the limit or not so many people do not know if they are good at their class or not. I have been the person that is probably bad and does not even know if I'm being bad, because there is no way to know unless I go through the hassle of installing a dps meter but given that I don't really raid, I never really had the energy to do that.

World PvP is just a fancy way to say "griefing". Sure, "For the Alliance" or "For the Horde" is a fun event, but it happens like ... twice a year? 99% of time it's "let's go kill the lowbie because lol".

Not really. You have games such as E.V.E or even BDO where PVP plays a completely different role to the game, in E.V.E it is deeply tied to the economy, same with Albion, etc. There are more games out there and World PVP does not really mean "plays like WoW".

[Valkyrie_Lenneth]

Casual players are people that don't give a lot of hours to the game

This is what your definition of a casual should be. Someone who doesn't spend much time in the game. That's all it means. Has nothing to do with skill level. You can have highly skilled casual players just as much as you can have terribly skilled hardcore players.



High skill also doesn't mean you won't die to the most basic of mechanics. You see it all the time in content where some ultimate titled player eats dirt from the easiest mechanic. Doesn't mean they are bad.


Now, do the trends show that people who play the game more tend to be more skilled? Yes. But that doesn't mean its always true.

[Adeacia]

Then why is it that in FFXIV you can be max level and have literally no idea what you are doing? This game requires only very very little of the player to progress through the story which is the only true required content of the game since so much is locked behind doing it.


You don't necessarily get better playing a game the longer you play it. You can not improve or even regress in some cases. 14 shows perfectly how you can complete an entire campaign comprised of the base game + 4 expansions of story and still fail basic tutorials on gameplay.

This is sounding like one of those scenarios where the person is like "You aren't playing as well as I personally think you should, therefore you are bad."

That's just your opinion. If they completed the content, then they have done the minimum needed

[Jojoya]

then maybe dont play a multiplayer game? especially not one that has a ToS Clause that says if the majority of your group doesnt like what you do, you can get the boot

ToS also says that action can be taken against the majority if their decision is made under a pretense that violates the ToS. The majority is not always assumed to be in the right.

This is sounding like one of those scenarios where the person is like "You aren't playing as well as I personally think you should, therefore you are bad."

That's just your opinion. If they completed the content, then they have done the minimum needed

Not necessarily true, though I suppose that depends in part what you consider the minimum needed.

I've definitely encounters players that were a hard carry through MSQ content. I had to solo the last half of both Beatrice and Scarmiglione in Troia the other night because the rest of the group was struggling with the mechanics.

Personally I don't mind helping out players who are struggling as long as i can see they are trying to help as best they can and have a good attitude.

I also understand (and to some extent agree) why some players don't feel they should be expected to do the same.

It is however SE's call on whether such players should be allowed to continue to advance through the game. Duty Support, unfortunately, is not always a helpful solution.

[Bearded]

Some people (actually a great many people) do not have any interest in the extreme / savage / ultimate content. That does not make someone who does that content good and those who do not do it bad. To use the terms good and bad in relation to players is a reflection of the mindset of the person making such a statement.

For me I have no interest in the so-called "harder" content. To be honest the "throw a ton of crazy mechanics at players in duty" is all getting a bit silly now and it is honestly hard to remember all the bad to avoid and the mechanics of all the duties. That does not make me a bad player.

I enjoy the game - I gather and craft and do the main quest with diversions of the tribal and other quests. Personally I could not find anything more uninteresting than repeating duty grinds for gear which becomes outdated in a matter of months but some people enjoy that and good on them. Again that does not make me a bad player.

The only bad players are ones who do not try their best, do not listen to help or say they are better than everyone else.