Yoshi-P lied

[Starshower]

This thread is a bit ridiculous. You're like, yeah, they did add a lot of content, but none of it actually matters cause I'm gonna describe it in a dismissive way which means it didn't exist at all basically. I could do the same kinda description for the other expansion's content. Your bias is dismissing every content because you chose the reality you want to see. No matter what they add in future patches, will you be satisfied?

[zabu]

he lied couple of times to ensure the business still running
Can some one tell me when can Yoship ensure “healer DPS is not required” ????? isn’t this a big lie in both savage/ultimate and casual content ?
ppl got flame playing healer for not DPSing still , what a lie !

[Ranhansha]

Not the first time. Not the last time.
We know he did some amazing things, we love what we has done for the game and I really admire him, but I've never understood why many people regard him as a God. At the end of the day, he is just an extremely busy guy who works for a really greedy company who probably keeps him on a tight as possible budget and don't allow him to speak clearly to players.

[Anselmet]

You know what I don't get. If FFXIV dev team is so tied up in say FFXVI or the graphical changes etc. then why don't they just reuse content. The relic step is a good example of where they can reuse old content and have in the past. I'm not asking for 15 Crystal Tower runs, but they could have made us collect things from old raids, fates, anything honestly to have us reengage with older stuff. Or maybe have it linked to the newer things like criterion and EO. Anything but what they did with tomes. Why not just add more rewards to criterion. Creating new glam gear, minions, emotes etc has to he easier than creating dedicated content to relics. And it would allow the community to have something to do. If they are so busy creating the future expansion, FFXVI, and the graphical change then okay maybe they have a right to reuse content. Be up front and then say but we want to give you something to do so here is these extra rewards and go redo Alexander for some pedals idc. Just something other than nothing.

[Atelier-Bagur]

You know what I don't get. If FFXIV dev team is so tied up in say FFXVI or the graphical changes etc. then why don't they just reuse content. The relic step is a good example of where they can reuse old content and have in the past. I'm not asking for 15 Crystal Tower runs, but they could have made us collect things from old raids, fates, anything honestly to have us reengage with older stuff. Or maybe have it linked to the newer things like criterion and EO. Anything but what they did with tomes. Why not just add more rewards to criterion. Creating new glam gear, minions, emotes etc has to he easier than creating dedicated content to relics. And it would allow the community to have something to do. If they are so busy creating the future expansion, FFXVI, and the graphical change then okay maybe they have a right to reuse content. Be up front and then say but we want to give you something to do so here is these extra rewards and go redo Alexander for some pedals idc. Just something other than nothing.

Because it has nothing to do with lack of resources. Resources dont mean jack against design choices and the team chose to respond to the general outcry of previous relics being a pain to do. They've stated even before 6.1, that EW's relics were going to be more quest oriented so people complaining the lack of exploratory zones, well they've also stated that they werent planning on having one for EW, so I dont understand why are people surprised as if this were new news.

The tomestone grind is the result of years of feedback from the community with the general consensus being they wanted to see the grind to be less annoying. Well here we are. Im desperately hoping 3rd step is different (please make it where we have to run Variant Dungeons when they release the 2nd one this patch cycle or something). While I was ok with the tomestone grind, just the fact that 2nd step is just the literal exact same thing was disappointing.

[Denji]

Because it has nothing to do with lack of resources. Resources dont mean jack against design choices and the team chose to respond to the general outcry of previous relics being a pain to do. They've stated even before 6.1, that EW's relics were going to be more quest oriented so people complaining the lack of exploratory zones, well they've also stated that they werent planning on having one for EW, so I dont understand why are people surprised as if this were new news.

The tomestone grind is the result of years of feedback from the community with the general consensus being they wanted to see the grind to be less annoying. Well here we are. Im desperately hoping 3rd step is different (please make it where we have to run Variant Dungeons when they release the 2nd one this patch cycle or something). While I was ok with the tomestone grind, just the fact that 2nd step is just the literal exact same thing was disappointing.

less annoying meant "not 5 billion world fates for random chance drops followed by needing to hope that you log in for the night when the eureka/bozja instance spawns the correct NM/CCL/Dal you need" not "oops, all tomestones!"

all people wanted was to be able to queue for CCL when they needed it and not just be forced to hope and pray that ccl spawns before the instance dies.

[Akiudo]

You know what I don't get. If FFXIV dev team is so tied up in say FFXVI or the graphical changes etc. then why don't they just reuse content. The relic step is a good example of where they can reuse old content and have in the past. I'm not asking for 15 Crystal Tower runs, but they could have made us collect things from old raids, fates, anything honestly to have us reengage with older stuff.

i actually agree with your post, however i also want to highlight that this is exactly why i disagree on all these "the devs are lazy" arguments people bring (not saying you said that, but obviously many people do, it's the very essence of this thread), because if this was simply about being "lazy" (or even out of time/money) they wouldn't need to develop more stuff, they would just need to make existing stuff more miserable. people can be unhappy about the current relic step all they want, i won't even argue on that, but even in the op of this thread we have the claim that relics were never lazier, which is just not true.

if people said the were never easier ? totally fair. but lazier ? Making each zone drop a singular item through fates which you need an average of 5-10 hours to farm per drop and from which you need one from every expansion zone is NOT more design work than the hildibrand questline that we got. people can argue the game needs more grindy content with meaningfull rewards as a sort of long term activity, i would even concede that people that do so would have a valid point, but things like island sanctuary are not "less work" than adding the next bozja just because it doesn't keep people grinding for just as long. the relics aren't any lazier than most arr/heavensward steps just because they take 1500 tomestomes per step instead of forcing you to run old primals 200 times. the real difference is that one took 50 hours if you were quick and the other takes 6 of actively playing casually, but this is nearly never what these threads discuss.

if more people were honest and said "i want for it to take a long time because i like to work towards a carrot on a stick" than there could be an honest discussion if this is a good thing, what it would mean for the game in general and all that. instead we get threads over threads over threads that act like handing out a weapon for 1500 tomestones is lazy while making you grind fates for 40 hours somehow is this awesome design accomplishment. (talking arr/hw here, eureka/bozja obviously took more effort than the current relics, though we got other stuff instead which leads back to "island sanctuary" didn't take "less work" from the developers just because it was over relatively quickly and a niche activity at that)

[Anselmet]

if people said the were never easier ? totally fair. but lazier ? Making each zone drop a singular item through fates which you need an average of 5-10 hours to farm per drop and from which you need one from every expansion zone is NOT more design work than the hildibrand questline that we got. people can argue the game needs more grindy content with meaningfull rewards as a sort of long term activity, i would even concede that people that do so would have a valid point, but things like island sanctuary are not "less work" than adding the next bozja just because it doesn't keep people grinding for just as long. the relics aren't any lazier than most arr/heavensward steps just because they take 1500 tomestomes per step instead of forcing you to run old primals 200 times. the real difference is that one took 50 hours if you were quick and the other takes 6 of actively playing casually, but this is nearly never what these threads discuss.

I'm going to likely be in the minority when I say Bozja is a good example of what they did with their content. It was a zone not just focused on the relic but allowed us to grind for mounts, haircuts, glamour etc. They used those two zones to their advantage to keep content going for people. Now, I don't want them in the slightest to add some of the steps to this relic weapon, because it was honestly awful. What would be good is to keep us engage with what they have now in the game and what they currently have. Do I want to run Hells Lid a bunch of times? Anti tower? No, but they can have us still re engage with older content and make it fun. I don't want to say they're lazy, they are likely very busy and stretched thin. However even if I gotta do some quests in Island Sanctuary to get some specialized ore for a few hours, then okay, good. Island Sanctuary is now being utilitized. Oh, did Nanamo find a special liquid in criterion for us after clearing? Yes, wonderful people are reengaging this content too. Oh and there is a new hat that Viera and Hrothgars can wear as well. Wow here is a catalyst finally needed after clearing EO! Wonderful and I worked on my weapon there as well.

I am not expecting them to make a new Bozja and I had fun doing this content. The issue is, I have no reason to keep doing this content!!! That is honestly the biggest problem. They have the content so use it. They have means to create things for it, but they aren't.

[Akiudo]

I am not expecting them to make a new Bozja and I had fun doing this content. The issue is, I have no reason to keep doing this content!!! That is honestly the biggest problem. They have the content so use it. They have means to create things for it, but they aren't.

i totally agree, there are a lot of situations where i think they could (and should) better utilize old content, if for no other reason than to save on actual development time which can than be used elsewhere.


like i said, mostly wanted to use your argument as a starting point to illustrate why i dislike people using the "lazyness" or even "time/recources" argument because 9/10 it ends with "if the devs just worked harder/cared more we would have longer lasting content" and it's just not as easy as that.

i mean just coming back to the op the main complaint really is "it's over to fast", but outside of the length of the mainstory quest (which hasn't been meaningfully longer than what we got in 6.3 since at least stormblood) that has literally nothing to do with the kind of content that we got. like, they could have easily added some weekly reward (and with "added some weekly reward" i really mean "timegate getting the rewards allready there) to variant/criterion dungeons to keep them "interesting" for more time, the relic could take 5, 10 times longer while changing nothing but the number of tomestones required and if we come back to "island sanctuary is bad" than it still took time, like if they did not design island sanctuary at all than surely they could have added a quest or two extra per patch cycle instead (not really, different teams and all but let's just say they ditched the guys that designed island sanctuary and highered another 2 or 3 quest designers instead).

i'm totally on board with utilizing older content better, because yes that is one aspect where i often feel they do fall short. I just wished that the people that feel they have nothing to do would discuss the whole "no long term content" thing as an actual failure design choice wise and not as a result of the devs being shortstaffed/underfunded/overworked/lazy/uncaring/"pick your adjective of choice that makes the devs or square enix as an organization sound shitty" because that at most is tertiary to the actual situation.

[Deceptus]

I'm going to likely be in the minority when I say Bozja is a good example of what they did with their content. It was a zone not just focused on the relic but allowed us to grind for mounts, haircuts, glamour etc. They used those two zones to their advantage to keep content going for people. Now, I don't want them in the slightest to add some of the steps to this relic weapon, because it was honestly awful. What would be good is to keep us engage with what they have now in the game and what they currently have. Do I want to run Hells Lid a bunch of times? Anti tower? No, but they can have us still re engage with older content and make it fun. I don't want to say they're lazy, they are likely very busy and stretched thin. However even if I gotta do some quests in Island Sanctuary to get some specialized ore for a few hours, then okay, good. Island Sanctuary is now being utilitized. Oh, did Nanamo find a special liquid in criterion for us after clearing? Yes, wonderful people are reengaging this content too. Oh and there is a new hat that Viera and Hrothgars can wear as well. Wow here is a catalyst finally needed after clearing EO! Wonderful and I worked on my weapon there as well.

I am not expecting them to make a new Bozja and I had fun doing this content. The issue is, I have no reason to keep doing this content!!! That is honestly the biggest problem. They have the content so use it. They have means to create things for it, but they aren't.

The problem with bozja is they put all of those incentives behind massive RNG grinds or 1% RNG drops.

Relic mats were more efficient OUTSIDE of bozja and still are to this day.