Tomestones.. Again.. for a relic..

[Supersnow845]

Where has this sudden idea that relic content should be catered to people who want to get every single come from

“AFR till you barf” is a meme for a reason, the relics are supposed to be long laborious grinds that make you proud when you achieve your chosen relic, if you have enough time in your life to do launch anima 13 times more power to you (though I honestly believe they nerfed the steps before it was physically possible to complete 13 anima relics on launch even if you skipped step one with the equivalent zeta relic) but I don’t think that should factor into how grindy the base relic is

At absolute minimum while I didn’t like the resistance grind do something like “do this step once then skip it for all subsequent relics” or even a eureka style “that relic will be so much easier to grind with eureka BIS making you a god” not just nerfing the step so hard that for the average person who just gets a relic for their main and maybe one other job (like me being a shield healer main that leans SCH I’ll still get the SGE weapon) they can have the relic as soon as they log on on patch day

[ty_taurus]

Where has this sudden idea that relic content should be catered to people who want to get every single come from

“AFR till you barf” is a meme for a reason, the relics are supposed to be long laborious grinds that make you proud when you achieve your chosen relic, if you have enough time in your life to do launch anima 13 times more power to you (though I honestly believe they nerfed the steps before it was physically possible to complete 13 anima relics on launch even if you skipped step one with the equivalent zeta relic) but I don’t think that should factor into how grindy the base relic is

At absolute minimum while I didn’t like the resistance grind do something like “do this step once then skip it for all subsequent relics” or even a eureka style “that relic will be so much easier to grind with eureka BIS making you a god” not just nerfing the step so hard that for the average person who just gets a relic for their main and maybe one other job (like me being a shield healer main that leans SCH I’ll still get the SGE weapon) they can have the relic as soon as they log on on patch day

Each expansion also adds new jobs though, which makes the length needed to collect them all longer and longer. But rather than make all of them easier by default, you can have a system that is designed to become easier for each weapon that you complete that step for to account for additional jobs. It would still be a long grind of course and provides a solid entry to that grind, but accounts for that increase in volume over time.

[Supersnow845]

Each expansion also adds new jobs though, which makes the length needed to collect them all longer and longer. But rather than make all of them easier by default, you can have a system that is designed to become easier for each weapon that you complete that step for to account for additional jobs. It would still be a long grind of course and provides a solid entry to that grind, but accounts for that increase in volume over time.

I mean new jobs should be completely irrelevant, they didn’t make anima easier than zeta with 3 extra jobs because relics were never meant to je designed around you getting every one of them

Everyone still has a main no matter how many jobs there are and that’s the class you should be getting the relic for, not getting 19 relics for every job

As for the sliding system I agree that’s better than nothing but I just don’t think that’s the right way to approach relics

[ty_taurus]

I mean new jobs should be completely irrelevant, they didn’t make anima easier than zeta with 3 extra jobs because relics were never meant to je designed around you getting every one of them

Everyone still has a main no matter how many jobs there are and that’s the class you should be getting the relic for, not getting 19 relics for every job

As for the sliding system I agree that’s better than nothing but I just don’t think that’s the right way to approach relics

I'm talking about every new relic grind. New jobs don't have old relics added, just that with new relic progression that gets adding, creating an initial challenge that gets easier the more weapons you complete helps address the fact that there are nearly double the amount of jobs now than what we had in ARR. Rather than making each weapon grind much shorter than ARR's grind to accommodate, having the first weapon be as long, but then each one after gets easier and easier to a point where the total amount of time is more similar.

[Supersnow845]

I'm talking about every new relic grind. New jobs don't have old relics added, just that with new relic progression that gets adding, creating an initial challenge that gets easier the more weapons you complete helps address the fact that there are nearly double the amount of jobs now than what we had in ARR. Rather than making each weapon grind much shorter than ARR's grind to accommodate, having the first weapon be as long, but then each one after gets easier and easier to a point where the total amount of time is more similar.

That’s what I’m saying, how many jobs in the game there are shouldn’t have any effect on new relic grinds because they aren’t designed to get every single one of them, EW should be no easier than ARR just because there is more jobs because you should still only be going for 1 or maybe 2 relics, this has nothing to do with retroactively adding new jobs to old relic grinds

The idea to make the first relic hard and subsequent easier is decent but still leaves you in the situation where it makes the subsequent relics way too easy; the relics should take a long time to get, not just be useless trinkets you dump in the glamour drawer like your 6 full sets of aglaia gear

[ty_taurus]

That’s what I’m saying, how many jobs in the game there are shouldn’t have any effect on new relic grinds because they aren’t designed to get every single one of them, EW should be no easier than ARR just because there is more jobs because you should still only be going for 1 or maybe 2 relics, this has nothing to do with retroactively adding new jobs to old relic grinds

The idea to make the first relic hard and subsequent easier is decent but still leaves you in the situation where it makes the subsequent relics way too easy; the relics should take a long time to get, not just be useless trinkets you dump in the glamour drawer like your 6 full sets of aglaia gear

Completionists are a subcategory of player, and there's no reason not to make the collection of additional relics gradually quicker for the players that want to collect them all to keep that task within a reasonable margin so long as the initial grind to collect your first still feels engaging and rewarding. What value is there in alienating a community of players for something that doesn't have an effect on the player who only gets 1?

[Fellgon]

My perspective about these poetics are just a start, the final step of this relic could be something diferent. At some point is really diferent, wernot going to a fate or doing infinite quests like zeta. Even if they create something, it wont change mtuch cause everything will be like : Quest, fates, poetics (grind new coins). This game is all about those, and i agree...relics are for those who dont enjoy do savage or ultimate.

Savage and ultimate are like dungeon + of wow, few "elites" players do the content, and casual gamers do other things. Besides, where are those so self entitled elites (whales) who could carry the mmo alone (so mutch money, so rich that they alone can pay all company incomes), wen blizz lost money cause loss the casual player base? Where are those who love chalenges, who dont bought FFO: Strangers in Paradase game (inspired in dark souls), a game that like it seens, dont have many players playing it?!

[Jojoya]

Where has this sudden idea that relic content should be catered to people who want to get every single come from

“AFR till you barf” is a meme for a reason, the relics are supposed to be long laborious grinds that make you proud when you achieve your chosen relic, if you have enough time in your life to do launch anima 13 times more power to you (though I honestly believe they nerfed the steps before it was physically possible to complete 13 anima relics on launch even if you skipped step one with the equivalent zeta relic) but I don’t think that should factor into how grindy the base relic is

Just because you and some other players envision the system this way doesn't mean that SE or all players do.

From comments I read and hear, most seem to see relics as something to collect to kill time between content releases and collectors tend to want it all. That means that someone newer to the game likely isn't going to want to be restricted to just the current expansion relic for one job. They're going to want all the relics from each expansion for each of the jobs they play.

That becomes a daunting task as new relics are added each expansion unless the process to gain those relics gets simplified over time. And so that appears to be what SE is doing. It's annoying to those who have been playing the game since ARR and have built their collections as each expansion happens. They now have less to fill their time. It's a blessing to players who are newer to the game and excited to have the chance to collect all the "cool things" that some MMOs remove access to after a certain period of time.

A game striving for longevity has to design for the latter type of player, not the former. Otherwise they only lose players while gaining few new players because new players feel like they'll never be able to get all the rewards that helped attract them to the game.

If it's a long grind that's meaningful to you and not having the weapon itself, then switch to the long grinds in the game that you haven't completed yet. Extremely few, if any, players have done them all. If the content for those grinds don't appeal to you, then you may want to find other games that have ones that do appeal so you can play those games once you've consumed what content that interests you in FFXIV (or vice versa).

But I do not see SE continuing to create long grinds for items that have new versions added every expansion when a large part of the player base has barely had the opportunity to start building their own collections. It would be a bad business decision.