Inevitable Job Simplifications?

[Rilifane]

That's how I do it. I just read my tooltips and give my training dummy a good beating. Lo and behold, I "do my job quite well" (or so my friends tell me as I'm on PS5) and bosses die. Unless you are doing world first etc you don't have to make it more complicated than that. I even use Stone, Sky, Sea or whatever it's called in EW. lol

I agree that you don't need Balance/ other tools to do fairly well, it's mainly for the small details that make the difference between good and optimal that you'll likely be lost without some outside source.
But to be fair, a lot of people say things like "I can keep uptime perfectly well without balance telling me to!" and then you look at their kills of something and notice they're sitting at something like 85% uptime, misaligned buff, missed several uses of cooldowns, have several broken combos and so on. They'll not suddenly do better because they also read on balance that uptime is important, that's not the point here.
The point is that people thinking they're doing well and proudly announcing that they know everything they need to and do well without any outside source (and often tend to subtly put others down who do use these sources) have been found to be a far cry from that more often than not both ingame and on the OF etc.
It has resulted in many people being sceptical when someone says "Nah, fam. I play my class well without any outside source. Lol who needs balance, just use common sense hurrdurr" even though you can definitely do pretty well by just reading tooltips. Not optimally, no, that's a number cruncher thing and you'd have to do more than just glance at a tooltip. But well? Definitely.

[UkcsAlias]

"Nah, fam. I play my class well without any outside source. Lol who needs balance, just use common sense hurrdurr" even though you can definitely do pretty well by just reading tooltips.

Tooltips are not an outside source! Outside sources are things like wiki's guides and forums.

And they arent always good as a source. A lot of people believe in certain things to be the right thing even if they arent.

If you only have 85% uptime consistently, yet you rarely ever wipe. You are still doing something right. And maybe that is the part that you arent the one to die often. Uptime doesnt consider all methods of consistency in it, yet they can matter more. If your uptime is normaly 100%, but certain boss mechanics targeting certain areas causing you to die, and that is pure RNG, then you are still less efficient. A single duty is not going to reveal someones general performance.

And then there is also the part that some people play while drunk, which can reduce efficiency as a result. But even there, the way they compensate can matter a lot. Most content is designed for casual play, and therefor does support such behaviour.

Even i play leviathan extreme while having some drinks for fun. I might be slightly less efficient in damage, but that fight is mostly about avoiding deaths as a group anyway, at which point damage is just something automatic.

[Rilifane]

Tooltips are not an outside source! Outside sources are things like wiki's guides and forums.

And they arent always good as a source. A lot of people believe in certain things to be the right thing even if they arent.

If you only have 85% uptime consistently, yet you rarely ever wipe. You are still doing something right. And maybe that is the part that you arent the one to die often. Uptime doesnt consider all methods of consistency in it, yet they can matter more. If your uptime is normaly 100%, but certain boss mechanics targeting certain areas causing you to die, and that is pure RNG, then you are still less efficient. A single duty is not going to reveal someones general performance.

And then there is also the part that some people play while drunk, which can reduce efficiency as a result. But even there, the way they compensate can matter a lot. Most content is designed for casual play, and therefor does support such behaviour.

Even i play leviathan extreme while having some drinks for fun. I might be slightly less efficient in damage, but that fight is mostly about avoiding deaths as a group anyway, at which point damage is just something automatic.

I never claimed that tooltips are an outside source.

And are we really using "Well, some people play drunk" as an argument? You completely missed the point. Or rather every single point in my post and read things into it I never said, on the contrary.

[tearagion]

I agree that you don't need Balance/ other tools to do fairly well, it's mainly for the small details that make the difference between good and optimal that you'll likely be lost without some outside source.
But to be fair, a lot of people say things like "I can keep uptime perfectly well without balance telling me to!" and then you look at their kills of something and notice they're sitting at something like 85% uptime, misaligned buff, missed several uses of cooldowns, have several broken combos and so on. They'll not suddenly do better because they also read on balance that uptime is important, that's not the point here.
The point is that people thinking they're doing well and proudly announcing that they know everything they need to and do well without any outside source (and often tend to subtly put others down who do use these sources) have been found to be a far cry from that more often than not both ingame and on the OF etc.
It has resulted in many people being sceptical when someone says "Nah, fam. I play my class well without any outside source. Lol who needs balance, just use common sense hurrdurr" even though you can definitely do pretty well by just reading tooltips. Not optimally, no, that's a number cruncher thing and you'd have to do more than just glance at a tooltip. But well? Definitely.

I don't think poorly of people who want to game from the shoulders of giants so to speak, but my point was: to claim that it's beyond the average player to do some math in a spreadsheet or infer basic rotational concepts, and that that is a good reason to keep jobs at a MCH-or-lower complexity is asinine.