Request: Additional Paladin Changes.

[Sqwall]

What.

They asked for Holy Shieldtron to work like Corundum or TBN.
You can have it bound multiple time in your hotbar, the macro and the non-macro.

You need to READ what the OP wrote more carefully.

"Sheltron & Holy Sheltron & Intervention.
Request:
Combine Sheltron and Intervention into one hotkey.
Using Sheltron gives you the buff, using sheltron on a party member gives them intervention.
(same as Gunbreakers Heart of Stone)"


So I say again with further explanation.

Paladin:
Holy Sheltron - Intervention

Gunbreaker:
Heart of Corundum - Heart of Stone

Dark Knight:
The Blackest Night - Oblation

Warrior:
Bloodwhetting - Nascent Flash


These ALL use separate skills for a reason. So that the each have unique buffs/mitigations. You think it would be wise to let WAR put bloodwhetting on other party members.....of course not. This is why Nascent is just a heal when the warrior attacks....not the other way around.

This is why TBN pops and gives boost damage to the DRK...not to the person I used it on.

And this is ALSO why Paladins intervention is completely different then Holy Sheltron when you read the tooltips. Fusing them together would mean making the skills the same....which they aren't.

I would like to add that Heart of Stone is in no way shape or form even close to Heart of Corundum. Heart of stone is just 15% flat, and also gives Brutal Shell heal to party member when used on them for 30 seconds...which is like 11-12 brutal shells. Heart of Corundum adds to Heart of stone by giving another 15% mitigation for 4s initially (total 30% for 4s then to 15%), but then also adds a 900 potency heal (which is basically an essential dignity at 30% HP, or Excogitation might come the closest) when you either fall below 50% HP or the duration of the effect ends. When you use it on another party member they get :
Flat 15% mitigation. Gunbreaker or party member
All Brutal Shell heals also given to a party member. Heart of stone only does bold text
Further 15% mitigation for a total of 30% for 4seconds then back to 15% for the rest of the ability duration.
900 potency heal when they fall below 50% HP or 20 second duration ends. Heart of Corundum does bold text and italics

[Rithy255]

These ALL use separate skills for a reason. So that the each have unique buffs/mitigations. You think it would be wise to let WAR put bloodwhetting on other party members.....of course not. This is why Nascent is just a heal when the warrior attacks....not the other way around.

This is why TBN pops and gives boost damage to the DRK...not to the person I used it on.

And this is ALSO why Paladins intervention is completely different then Holy Sheltron when you read the tooltips. Fusing them together would mean making the skills the same....which they aren't.

Intervention is Holy shelltron for a friend, they do the same thing the only difference is Intervention is every so slightly worse because it requires the PLD to actively be using rampart or sentinel to get the full effect.

Heart of stone? no it upgrades into Heart of corundum...
Oblation? No it's nothing like TBN, it's there because you can't give TBN mitigation without reworking the ability.
Nascent flash? You could easily turn into a skill that targets other players, the heal effect can just be apart of warriors buff, you could just add the glint to any target that isn't the warrior.

Intervention and Holy sheltron aren't completely different abilities, making sheltron targetable is basically what intervention currently does.

[Sqwall]

Intervention is Holy shelltron for a friend, they do the same thing the only difference is Intervention is every so slightly worse because it requires the PLD to actively be using rampart or sentinel to get the full effect.

Heart of stone? no it upgrades into Heart of corundum...
Oblation? No it's nothing like TBN, it's there because you can't give TBN mitigation without reworking the ability.
Nascent flash? You could easily turn into a skill that targets other players, the heal effect can just be apart of warriors buff, you could just add the glint to any target that isn't the warrior.

Intervention and Holy sheltron aren't completely different abilities, making sheltron targetable is basically what intervention currently does.

Holy Sheltron is not the same as Intervention

Read the tooltips.

If they were the same.....they would do the exact same thing. Which they don't.

Not the same mitigation, unless fulfilling certain criteria.

[Rithy255]

Holy Sheltron is not the same as Intervention

Read the tooltips.

You said "read the tooltips" but you're trying to compare heart of stone to abilities like Oblation and nascent flash? when it would be comparable to shelltron or Raw Intuition because they're abilites that upgrade.

They function as the same, you use Intervention on party member, you use Holy sheltron on yourself, Gunbreaker uses Heart of corundum on self or party members, If you reworked Holy shelltron to target other players and self and also not have a long CD (3 seconds or so) It would function literally the same as it does now on Paladin.

[Sqwall]

You said "read the tooltips" but you're trying to compare heart of stone to abilities like Oblation and nascent flash? when it would be comparable to shelltron or Raw Intuition because they're abilites that upgrade.

They function as the same, you use Intervention on party member, you use Holy sheltron on yourself, Gunbreaker uses Heart of corundum on self or party members, If you reworked Holy shelltron to target other players and self and also not have a long CD (3 seconds or so) It would function literally the same as it does now on Paladin.

Well now you're talking about removing intervention if I could just use Holy Sheltron on other party members. Just roll with Holy Sheltron, why even bother with intervention. Which would bascially be broken as hell if I could use it on the MT. Or better yet....just roll x2 PLD and just alternate Holy Sheltron on the MT....tank nigh invincible. 30% reduced damage + a clemency level HoT constantly rolling.

Why don't we just put all mitigation on a SINGLE button for tanks to mash?
Rampart
Bulwark
Sentinel
Passage of Arms
Divine Viel
Intervention
Reprisal
Hallowed Ground
Cover
....just make it all one button so it's simple....just hit Holy-MOLY-GREAT-GOOGLY-MOOGLY-sheltron.

That should make playing on controller super easy.

[RyuuZero]

Well now you're talking about removing intervention if I could just use Holy Sheltron on other party members. Just roll with Holy Sheltron, why even bother with intervention. Which would bascially be broken as hell if I could use it on the MT. Or better yet....just roll x2 PLD and just alternate Holy Sheltron on the MT....tank nigh invincible. 30% reduced damage + a clemency level HoT constantly rolling.

Why don't we just put all mitigation on a SINGLE button for tanks to mash?
Rampart
Bulwark
Sentinel
Passage of Arms
Divine Viel
Intervention
Reprisal
Hallowed Ground
Cover
....just make it all one button so it's simple....just hit Holy-MOLY-GREAT-GOOGLY-MOOGLY-sheltron.

That should make playing on controller super easy.

you can already do that by writing a macro.. but I wouldn't put Passage of Arms, Divine Veil, Hallowed Ground and Cover in there since those Skills have different effects/uses/situations^^

[Sqwall]

Nascent flash? You could easily turn into a skill that targets other players, the heal effect can just be apart of warriors buff, you could just add the glint to any target that isn't the warrior.

Nascent Flash CAN target other players. The WAR DOES also get the heal effect that the person targeted with nascent gets. You can't give the warrior nascent glint...only a party member when you use nascent flash. The party member with glint get's 10% reduced damage, and stem the tide which also reduces damage by another 10% for 4s.

The warrior get's no mitigation benefits...only heals from stem the tide. Purely designed to supplement heals/mit for MT or squishy. I usually macro this to our resident SMN, BLM, or RDM.

[Rithy255]

Nascent Flash CAN target other players. The WAR DOES also get the heal effect that the person targeted with nascent gets. You can't give the warrior nascent glint...only a party member when you use nascent flash. The party member with glint get's 10% reduced damage, and stem the tide which also reduces damage by another 10% for 4s.

The warrior get's no mitigation benefits...only heals from stem the tide. Purely designed to supplement heals/mit for MT or squishy. I usually macro this to our resident SMN, BLM, or RDM.

Its not impossible to rework Bloodwhetting into a targetable ability, If used on self you get the Nascent Flash effect as a healing effect, but targeting someone else will give still give you the nascent flash, but give the target nascent "glint" and the normal mitigation and barrier stuff you get from bloodwhetting.

I don't even care too much about Nascent flash besides that, warrior isn't struggling for button space, PLD is currently the one struggling with that.

With PLD it's much easier Holy shelltron can easily be a targetable ability, theirs no real difference in intervention then it being slightly worse.

Edit: (because of reply)
Changing Intervention/holy shelltron is nothing Like removing all mitigations into one button, I'm not arguing this anymore as it seems like you're not even looking at the argument, it wouldn't be "broken" If Holy shelltron is able to target other players, Intervention already does that. It wouldn't be OP if you could use it on the MT, Intervention already mitigates almost 30% damage.

[Sqwall]

Its not impossible to rework Bloodwhetting into a targetable ability, If used on self you get the Nascent Flash effect as a healing effect, but targeting someone else will give still give you the nascent flash, but give the target nascent "glint" and the normal mitigation and barrier stuff you get from bloodwhetting.

I don't even care too much about Nascent flash besides that, warrior isn't struggling for button space, PLD is currently the one struggling with that.

With PLD it's much easier Holy shelltron can easily be a targetable ability, theirs no real difference in intervention then it being slightly worse.

I honestly don't know where people are getting this idea that they can't fit everything on their hot bar as PLD? This whole thread was based on the idea that PLD has a bloated tool kit. It might be bloated by maybe....ehhh...2 skills...tops.

I have literally everything on my hot bar as a PS5 player...even provoke...shirk...potion. Do controller players even know hot to use the expanded cross hotbar?

[Arohk]

I honestly don't know where people are getting this idea that they can't fit everything on their hot bar as PLD?

You also need to bind the hotbar to hotkeys, or are you a clicker?

A comfortable amount of hotkeys (only to play the class/job) is 16-20 hotkeys maximum. right now almsot all jobs in FF go far over that.