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Thread: PLD changes

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  1. #1
    Player Gserpent's Avatar
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    Mar 2021
    Posts
    800
    Character
    Grinning Serpent
    World
    Maduin
    Main Class
    Culinarian Lv 90
    Divine Might is a really cool idea but it's half-baked. It's the cartridge gauge except you can only have one shell. FoF *or* Req has to stay because that's how the game is designed. If we're being really lazy, you'd just copy WAR or GNB and be done with it. I favor copying WAR, myself, because aside from it being too idiot-proof and lacking oGCDs, it's a simple monke brain gameplay experience.

    Sheltron/Holy Sheltron removed. Intervention can now be cast on self or on allies for 15% damage reduction (Heart of Stone/Corundum clone.) No resource cost. Cover is a 2 minute cooldown, no resource cost, no changes (still useless in raids but that's fine.)

    Oath Gauge renamed to Divine Might gauge. Generate 20 Divine Might from Royal Authority with combo bonus, 10 from Goring Blade with combo bonus. Casting Holy Spirit, Holy Circle, or Clemency will consume 50 Divine Might if available to increase potency and remove cast time. If this would be tricky to program (it sounds tricky), I guess just add some kind of button like Infuriate that simply consumes gauge and applies the effects as a buff? I would prefer to not lose the ability to hardcast those spells, as it is unlikely to affect meaningful gameplay balance but preserves a tiny bit of class flavor and it *is* nice to have the option to potentially save a scuffed normal run by hardcasting a few Clemency.

    Goring Blade now applies a 10% damage up buff lasting 30 seconds, stacks to up to 60 seconds. Potency of actions adjusted to compensate. Atonement is removed.
    Passage at Arms removed, Divine Veil improved to be equivalent to Shake It Off. Yes, this is a loss of class fantasy but I can't see any practical way of remedying this issue. Wings is useless in most circumstances because of its oddities, but if it were adjusted to be reliable and useful it would result in PLD being the only tank with two separate raidwide mitigation tools, which would present major balance concerns.

    Req remains as it is on live, except it turns into Confiteor when activated and it has 25yd range. This is our Inner Release, it's fine as it is on live (aside from requiring a plugin to reduce button bloat), it's one of the only things in this rework that is absolutely done right.

    I don't think PLD would need an Infuriate analogue, because we'd have two oGCDs to fiddle with (Spirits/Circle) instead of just one. If it feels too slow/low DPS without Infuriate involved, then you could just increase builders to 30 and 20 respectively and I think it would accomplish the same basic idea of "moar fell cleaves." I don't think Circle of Scorn needs to lose the dot/be changed, because it's a single dot effect and the way that fights are designed tends to mean it gets to run its full duration anyway. Goring Blade dot was the one that kept getting trimmed at bad times.



    I'm sure someone familiar with GNB could do this but for GNB copycat instead. I don't understand why they didn't just clone WAR or GNB and be done with it. I wouldn't *like* it, but I would just grumble and accept it because as I said, we *knew* we weren't going to keep the rotation going into this.
    (7)

  2. #2
    Player
    Kemeko's Avatar
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    Oct 2015
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    50
    Character
    Kemeko Arakawa
    World
    Lamia
    Main Class
    Paladin Lv 90
    Why limit Cover if its useless. Make it a Dance Partner toggle with 3s recast. Put block back on Sheltron/Holy Shieltron but with the bonus mitigation. Turn Bulwark into 50% hp shield on oath gauge. Increase Intervention by another 20% mitigation. Add 10 oath gauge to all combo finishers and 10 oath gauge per 1000 mp cost for spells. Passage of Arms gives 50 oath gauge. Divine Veil has 3 10% hp shield that spreads upon using Clemency/Holy spells, doubles healing potencies, halves mp cost, all spells no cast times. Clemency gives 2 Divine Might when used with Divine Veil. Add a button that reduces Divine Veil recast by 30s at 50 oath gauge cost. Divine Veil turns Clemency into an aoe heal. Cover doubles Clemency heal potency, gives Clemency shield barrier powers, and doubles the shield of Bulwark. Become a true Paladin!
    (5)
    Last edited by Kemeko; 01-12-2023 at 08:52 PM.

  3. #3
    Player Gserpent's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2021
    Posts
    800
    Character
    Grinning Serpent
    World
    Maduin
    Main Class
    Culinarian Lv 90
    Quote Originally Posted by Kemeko View Post
    Why limit Cover if its useless. Make it a Dance Partner toggle with 3s recast. Put block back on Sheltron/Holy Shieltron but with the bonus mitigation. Turn Bulwark into 50% hp shield on oath gauge. Increase Intervention by another 20% mitigation. Add 10 oath gauge to all combo finishers and 10 oath gauge per 1000 mp cost for spells. Passage of Arms gives 50 oath gauge. Divine Veil has 3 10% hp shield that spreads upon using Clemency/Holy spells, doubles healing potencies, halves mp cost, all spells no cast times. Clemency gives 2 Divine Might when used with Divine Veil. Add a button that reduces Divine Veil recast by 30s at 50 oath gauge cost. Divine Veil turns Clemency into an aoe heal. Cover increases Clemency heal potency. gives Clemency shield barrier powers, and doubles the shield of Bulwark. Become a true Paladin!
    Because if Cover is remotely applicable to raiding then it makes PLD overpowered.

    Mitigation among tanks *MUST* be homogenized or it will lead to legitimate "taking anything but this class is griefing" scenarios.
    (1)

  4. #4
    Player
    nia_saeli's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2022
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    29
    Character
    Nia Saeli
    World
    Atomos
    Main Class
    Dancer Lv 90
    Quote Originally Posted by Gserpent View Post

    I'm sure someone familiar with GNB could do this but for GNB copycat instead. I don't understand why they didn't just clone WAR or GNB and be done with it. I wouldn't *like* it, but I would just grumble and accept it because as I said, we *knew* we weren't going to keep the rotation going into this.
    The (tragically) funny thing is that they are like, a handful of changes from being like GNB.

    - Divine Might Stacks to 3
    - Gain a stack of divine might when sword oath ends (cartridge every third attack analog and it keeps you from wanting to drop them)
    - Goring Blade has AoE falloff to be inline with double down. (Alternatively give it a DoT to be more like sonic break, either is fine).

    Then we've got a proper shieldbreaker where it's GNB without as much weaving. Though I still would have preferred that they leave the prior iteration which felt just about perfect at 90, and was pretty serviceable at all levels of content. IDK, I knew I wasn't going to be happy with the rework, but yeah... It's pretty disappointing that it's feels so unfinished.
    (0)
    Last edited by nia_saeli; 01-12-2023 at 05:34 PM. Reason: a word and some follow-up

  5. #5
    Player Gserpent's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2021
    Posts
    800
    Character
    Grinning Serpent
    World
    Maduin
    Main Class
    Culinarian Lv 90
    Quote Originally Posted by nia_saeli View Post
    The (tragically) funny thing is that they are like, a handful of changes from being like GNB.

    - Divine Might Stacks to 3
    - Gain a stack of divine might when sword oath ends (cartridge every third attack analog and it keeps you from wanting to drop them)
    - Goring Blade has AoE falloff to be inline with double down. (Alternatively give it a DoT to be more like sonic break, either is fine).

    Then we've got a proper shieldbreaker where it's GNB without as much weaving. Though I still would have preferred that they leave the prior iteration which felt just about perfect at 90, and was pretty serviceable at all levels of content. IDK, I knew I wasn't going to be happy with the rework, but yeah... It's pretty disappointing that it's feels so unfinished.
    It's even better - it's equally a couple steps shy of being WAR. Remove FoF, Goring Blade applies a buff (10% haste in my fantasy world because I like haste way more than 10% more damage, gotta go fast.) Req is a self-buff enables use of Confiteor and Blade spells, Req is replaced by Confiteor/Blades while active (Inner Release.) Oath Gauge removed, replaced with Divine Might Gauge. Royal Authority generates 20 gauge, Goring Blade generates 10 gauge. Holy Spirit, Clemency, and Holy Circle spend gauge, each costing 50; potency of each is adjusted to account for no longer being spammable. Atonement removed. Sheltron removed, Intervention is now 15% mitigation baseline and can be applied to self; does not scale with active effects on self when applied to ally (this is basically Heart of Corundum but there's literally no reason to keep Sheltron and Intervention as separate skills if they would share a cooldown a la Bloodwhetting-Nascent Flash.) You would still need an Infuriate button and the "refund" mechanic for a WAR clone, but I think you could accomplish the same general idea by either increasing base builder amounts (30/20) or by making Circle and Expiciacion generate gauge. Not an *exact* WAR clone, but very close. It sounds pretty decent to play, if you ask me.

    For low level stuff, changes I'd make would include: Holy Spirit at 35, Holy Circle at 40, gap closer at 45. Req at level 60, it grants 4 free Holy Spirit, Holy Circle, or Clemency casts at increased potency. It is trait upgraded to grant Confiteor Ready at level 80; as in live, using Confiteor or the later Blades spells consumes a charge of Req.
    (3)