simple way to reduce button bloat without changing gameplay

[kevin_satron]

i would love if they add new feature for hotbars where we can put 2 any skills in 1 button. like for 1-2-3 combos turn to 1-1-2 or 1-2-2 combos. Just like in pvp action rotations

[Rein_eon_Osborne]

I will hate it if they force one button pvp rotation to everybody, but if they make it an option, then fine.

[magitekLuna]

simple way to reduce button bloat without changing gameplay? they did it in PVP . just use the same thing.

[undull1]

If only there were some way to please both sides of the PvP combo button argument.....
Like maybe......putting the "combo" action as a separate action in the actions menu....

Yep, that would just be too craaaaazy to consider.

[Yeol]

I'm using the hotbar swap feature the game offers and switch to the AoE hotbar when needed.
It made me realize how some jobs have button bloat simply because they have AoE versions of certain abilities/skills that share CD with the single target version.

[PredatoryCatgirl]

everyone is on "single target" stance by default, then pressing the AOE stance changes your skills to their corresponding AOE versions.

This is literally what I do.

My primary hotbar has an in game macro to swap between hotbars 1 and 3. Bar 1 has single target attacks, and a macro to go to 3. Bar 3 has AOEs, and a macro to go to 1.

[Zebraoracle]

Unfortunately it's not really as simple as adding the PvP single button rotations to PvE when jobs like monk and black mage exist.

[Rilifane]

FFXIV has honestly absolutely terrible hotbar slot economy.
All classes have several redundant skills with aoe versions of single target skills being the main culprit here but closely followed by skills that can only be used in sequence yet take up multiple slots (e.g. Ley Lines/ Between the Lines) and a couple of copy-pasted generic "a bit of extra potency on a cooldown" skills or "move HP to the right but with a different name".
And as angelar pointed out, any solutions through hotbar swapping, crime tools, just not using skills and so on do not mean anything from a dev standpoint as you can't guarantee players will use it so you need to plan with a "worst case" in mind and that worst case is that our hotbars are full and have no more space for adding skills without merging/ deleting others.

Whether they add a stance to swap between single target/ aoe or just make all single target skills aoe with a falloff, they need to find a better solution than pruning skills from lower levels and giving them back in the newest expansion with a different name. Low level gameplay becomes increasingly barebone and boring because of this and yet all the wasted hotbar slots on separate aoe rotations don't add anything that would justify blocking this many slots when instead of a simplified "just spam in trash pulls" you could instead have smoother skill acquisition and better low level gameplay and more interaction and interesting skills in your toolkit.
Do we really need "just like single target... but aoe!" or several flat potency, press on cooldown skills?
It limits skill design without adding anything to justify it.

Unfortunately it's not really as simple as adding the PvP single button rotations to PvE when jobs like monk and black mage exist.

Merge:
Blizzard III and High Blizzard II
Blizzard IV and Freeze
Fire III and High Fire II
Despair and Flare
Foul and Xeno
Thunder III and Thunder IV
Ley Lines and Between the Lines

7 buttons saved. Aoe rotations aren't inherently interesting because they are just simplified, shorter snigle target rotations so it's not like you would lose an exciting part of your gameplay.
Especially considering aoe rotations are exclusive to some casual content situations (and not even all, just SOME), like dungeon trash pulls, fates and treasure maps while polishing the universal rotation would mean more interesting gameplay in all types of content, from the MSQ progger or fate farmer to the Ultimate raider.

[Zebraoracle]

Merge:
Blizzard III and High Blizzard II
Blizzard IV and Freeze
Fire III and High Fire II
Despair and Flare
Foul and Xeno
Thunder III and Thunder IV
Ley Lines and Between the Lines

7 buttons saved. Aoe rotations aren't inherently interesting because they are just simplified, shorter snigle target rotations so it's not like you would lose an exciting part of your gameplay.
Especially considering aoe rotations are exclusive to some casual content situations (and not even all, just SOME), like dungeon trash pulls, fates and treasure maps while polishing the universal rotation would mean more interesting gameplay in all types of content, from the MSQ progger or fate farmer to the Ultimate raider.

While I agree AoE rotations aren't super interesting and merging them like that could potentially work, I was referring strictly to the PvP style of "press this one button that changes as you press it" single button combo rotation that people are suggesting. Unless Square is going to map out the absolutely OPTIMAL BLM rotation, I don't see that kind of system ever being applied in PvE lol.

But yeah, there are definitely skills that can be merged to reduce the bloat. There's also the idea of just... revamping the jobs as well, which will probably never happen, because Square is just so in love with the 2 minute burst window idea. As well as healers being button bloat: the role.

[Rilifane]

You're right, just merging combos wouldn't work for something like BLM which is why I don't think it's the solution either. But I was personally never too fond of combos anyway because unless they are branching combos that give you a meaningful choice, they are extremely wasteful with hotbar slots and don't add anything to the gameplay. Pressing glowing buttons in order for slightly increased potency isn't the pinnacle of skill expression, no matter what some people claim. And your entire ARR is basically just "press 123 in order" with things slowly getting added during HW but you feel the extreme low level skill pruning in lv 70 Ultimates.
If the only engagement comes from "Well, you could accidentally press the wrong button in panic!" then that's really not much compared to, say, miscalculating mana ticks and being left with a short AF phase when that wasn't your intention or starting your melee combo at the wrong time.

Branching combos are good though and they're not wasteful either. And they offer a simplified but solid version of your rotation if you're just not at a point where you're good at doing them correctly. I was one of the people that just used 123456 on MNK when levelling it in ShB. Was it ideal? Nope. But it did the job well enough and I wasn't neck-deep into MNK gameplay.

Of course I'd personally prefer to have a good revamp with a close look at a lot of skills, the 2min burst meta that can go to hell and adjust it all but I know it won't happen.
FFXIV relies a lot on having almost 3 hotbars full of fluff and the sheer amount makes it seem complex but then about 1/4 of it is for aoe alone, 1/4 is "fluff/ niche/ you never use it lol", 1/4 is "flat potency press on cooldown" and the remaining couple of buttons are your core rotation - which then boils down to pressing 123 and something else in the correct order.
And I've seen in other games how you can engage a pretty engaging gameplay with just 5 buttons. And yes, that would work in FFXIV as well.
But quantity gets mistaken for quality here on many classes and the below current expansion gameplay gets increasingly worse.