Why is everyone anxious about a PLD Rework?

[Gserpent]

I don't know how I can be more clear about this, any other tank cannot use two of their short cd mitigations at once

I know, but they don't *need* to. Because their short cooldown skill actually works as designed, whereas the developers inexplicably managed to not notice blocking not applying to dots? For all Yoshida's claims of "they got too good at P8S," it makes me wonder if anyone on the team was actually *playing* Paladin with crafted ilvl gear...

And, by the way, there's an easy way to fix "well if they made Sheltron stop sucking and also made it cost no gauge, it would be OP" - just make Intervention and Sheltron share a 25 sec cooldown. You'd still be able to dump gauge on Clemency, which is in line with Aurora, Oblation, etc.

[Marxam]

I know, but they don't *need* to. Because their short cooldown skill actually works as designed, whereas the developers inexplicably managed to not notice blocking not applying to dots? For all Yoshida's claims of "they got too good at P8S," it makes me wonder if anyone on the team was actually *playing* Paladin with crafted ilvl gear...

And, by the way, there's an easy way to fix "well if they made Sheltron stop sucking and also made it cost no gauge, it would be OP" - just make Intervention and Sheltron share a 25 sec cooldown. You'd still be able to dump gauge on Clemency, which is in line with Aurora, Oblation, etc.

If they wanted to buff sheltron they could just make oath gauge work the same way as beast gauge for combo enders. WAR gets to FC every 15 secs just by doing one SE and SP combo. If goring and RA worked the same way that's a sheltron every 15 secs, effectively putting it on the same recast as TBN. This is also assuming Atonement survives as the devs have shown that they will remove a skill if it just bloats a rotation i.e. SAM.

[Gserpent]

If they wanted to buff sheltron they could just make oath gauge work the same way as beast gauge for combo enders. WAR gets to FC every 15 secs just by doing one SE and SP combo. If goring and RA worked the same way that's a sheltron every 15 secs, effectively putting it on the same recast as TBN. This is also assuming Atonement survives as the devs have shown that they will remove a skill if it just bloats a rotation i.e. SAM.

I mean, we're all fairly certain that PLD will just be "WAR with a shield", so this doesn't seem unlikely to happen.

[Rithy255]

I mean, we're all fairly certain that PLD will just be "WAR with a shield", so this doesn't seem unlikely to happen.

I doubt it will exactly be warrior, but it will share a lot of baseline with warrior and dark knight.
Perhaps even they might go with making it similar to gunbreaker, considering finishing your basic combo gives you atonement on PLD and Ammo (that can lead into a 3 button combo with weaving)

I don't think theirs any one way PLD will go, they will just likely remove Fight or flight and goring blade (make it like wars damage buff, like I've said before), because the problems with PLD having a second burst and DOT upkeep being hard for downtime situations, No tanks "dot" other then PLD really has to upkeep their DOT so much, GNB/DRK both have two (basically, your shadow acts as a fancy DOT on drk), but both really don't need to play around it like PLD.

Realistically it's safe to say PLD will share a lot with warrior/drk likely though, we will see really.

[Gserpent]

I doubt it will exactly be warrior, but it will share a lot of baseline with warrior and dark knight.
Perhaps even they might go with making it similar to gunbreaker, considering finishing your basic combo gives you atonement on PLD and Ammo (that can lead into a 3 button combo with weaving)

I don't think theirs any one way PLD will go, they will just likely remove Fight or flight and goring blade (make it like wars damage buff, like I've said before), because the problems with PLD having a second burst and DOT upkeep being hard for downtime situations, No tanks "dot" other then PLD really has to upkeep their DOT so much, GNB/DRK both have two (basically, your shadow acts as a fancy DOT on drk), but both really don't need to play around it like PLD.

Realistically it's safe to say PLD will share a lot with warrior/drk likely though, we will see really.

Charge-based 60 second unga bunga, maybe a second combo to maintain some sort of buff (Goring Blade is effectively just an always-on damage buff as long as you're hitting the target so I could see them keeping it, except for the blades combo and Goring Blade overwriting each other.) I think the only big thing is what they'll do with the Oath Gauge and abilities keyed to it. Will Atonement become our Fell Cleave?

[ForsakenRoe]

Will Atonement become our Fell Cleave?

no, that already exists: holy spirit. holy spirit = fellcleave, holy circle = decimate, requiescat = IR, and confiteor = primal rend, atonement right now in WAR terms would be like if SE said 'ok if you press storms path, you get to use butchers block 3 times (it has the same damage as path)'. atm we use 4 holy spirits then confetti, and have a 63s loop so we have to drop an atonement/holy spirit, depending which is weaker cos of SE's balance, so it seems like the low hanging fruit SE would go for, to make us use 1 less holy spirit per requiescat window, and buff something to compensate for the lost potency. it's 600p per holy spirit, and we would (after this change) have 3 holy spirits, confiteor, 3 blade hits, so i expect they would buff HS and each of the blade hits by 100 and job's done (confiteor is already bad for crit variance so please SE lets not buff that any more). it'd also make the full req window 7 GCDs long, which makes it more comfortably fit inside a 20s raidbuff window. anything more than that would be quite a surprise to me

[dspguy]

no, that already exists: holy spirit. holy spirit = fellcleave, holy circle = decimate, requiescat = IR, and confiteor = primal rend, atonement right now in WAR terms would be like if SE said 'ok if you press storms path, you get to use butchers block 3 times (it has the same damage as path)'. atm we use 4 holy spirits then confetti, and have a 63s loop so we have to drop an atonement/holy spirit, depending which is weaker cos of SE's balance, so it seems like the low hanging fruit SE would go for, to make us use 1 less holy spirit per requiescat window, and buff something to compensate for the lost potency. it's 600p per holy spirit, and we would (after this change) have 3 holy spirits, confiteor, 3 blade hits, so i expect they would buff HS and each of the blade hits by 100 and job's done (confiteor is already bad for crit variance so please SE lets not buff that any more). it'd also make the full req window 7 GCDs long, which makes it more comfortably fit inside a 20s raidbuff window. anything more than that would be quite a surprise to me

I love the PLD-to-WAR comparison. And that right there is why SE being so formulaic is hurting the game. I have my PLD and WAR hotbars nearly identical. The 1-2-3 Royal Authority combo is my Storm's Path combo. The PLD DoT combo is my Storm's Eye combo. Requiescat is slotted where Inner Release is. Holy Spirit/Circle are slotted for Fell Cleave and Decimate. Holy Sheltron is where Bloodwhetting is - Sentinel where Vengeance is. Etc etc etc. The differences are minor. While the rotation is different, it isn't that different.

[ForsakenRoe]

If they wanted to buff sheltron they could just make oath gauge work the same way as beast gauge for combo enders. WAR gets to FC every 15 secs just by doing one SE and SP combo. If goring and RA worked the same way that's a sheltron every 15 secs, effectively putting it on the same recast as TBN. This is also assuming Atonement survives as the devs have shown that they will remove a skill if it just bloats a rotation i.e. SAM.

See I was trying to math out what good values there would be for each GCD like 'would it be better if RA gave 10 or 15, how should 3 Atonements compare to a 124 combo refreshing Goring', then I realised that if Sheltron had a 15s CD like that, it'd mean a 80% uptime on the Knight's Benediction regen effect, which would be hilarious