Why is everyone anxious about a PLD Rework?

[Absurdity]

"Because savage/ultimate raiding is what they design and balance"
I guess they should remove Peloton, because you don't use it in raids!!!

Not the best example because you do actually use pre-pull Peloton.

[Sparkthor]

When I play Paladin i LOVE to have two charges of schiltron/intervene. It greatly help in raid content when you can protect yourself and your co tank on double/share TB. Clemency may be situationnal, but hell, it works fine. Moreover, people love having distinct tools in their kit what feel some jobs more unique, and when one of the biggest complain about the game is the homogeneisation (which is somehow true but necessary IMO).

If trully the PLD need more sustain, the best way to have it is to add another OGCD heal, or, if we didn't want to add something, put some heal on attonement or combo finisher.

[Rithy255]

Not the best example because you do actually use pre-pull Peloton.

You do? first I've heard of this lol.

[AnotherPerson]

If Sheltron doesn't cost gauge, it effectively means you get two Clemency casts per gauge on top of a Sheltron cast. That's better than the current standard of two Sheltrons and no Clemency casts.

No, that's for being lossless in DPS. As it stands currently, you get the current standard of 2 Sheltrons + 5 Clemency Casts (or more if you focus on regenerating MP) if you want to focus on survival. You only have 2 Sheltrons + no Clemency casts if you focus on DPS optimal gameplay.

That doesn't improve PLD's overall survivability because you trade more casts of Clemency with having lossless healing. You might as well put a separate oGCD healing skill for that if you want to increase PLD's overall survivability without DPS loss.

[Rithy255]

I just wanna comment on how you could make clemency both a ogcd and gcd (might sound weird on paper)

Lets say you reworked oath so it had no ties to shelltron/Intervention, I'm guessing having 50 oath (or something) could proc clemency to become a OCD, Cost no Mp and be instant cast this would even be a "decent alternative" against outright removing current clemency.

I don't really think clemency should be a oath gauge thing either way just food for thought.

[Gserpent]

No, that's for being lossless in DPS. As it stands currently, you get the current standard of 2 Sheltrons + 5 Clemency Casts (or more if you focus on regenerating MP) if you want to focus on survival. You only have 2 Sheltrons + no Clemency casts if you focus on DPS optimal gameplay.

That doesn't improve PLD's overall survivability because you trade more casts of Clemency with having lossless healing. You might as well put a separate oGCD healing skill for that if you want to increase PLD's overall survivability without DPS loss.

Except you're never in any scenario where you need to actually halt DPS to pump Clemency. Not in any kind of content that actually matters.

And solo content doesn't matter, anyway, because other tanks are better at soloing stuff than PLD is, WAR especially. I think y'all are dramatically underestimating how much healing over time the combo finishers are... which PLD doesn't get. If PLD needs any added healing, it's on Royal Authority (or Atonement, I guess?)

[Espon]

I just wanna comment on how you could make clemency both a ogcd and gcd (might sound weird on paper)

Lets say you reworked oath so it had no ties to shelltron/Intervention, I'm guessing having 50 oath (or something) could proc clemency to become a OCD, Cost no Mp and be instant cast this would even be a "decent alternative" against outright removing current clemency.

I don't really think clemency should be a oath gauge thing either way just food for thought.

I had a suggestion on earlier in this thread that I thought could work.

Random example: Expiacion grants a stack of Clarity. At 2 stacks Clemency has no cast time, costs no MP, and is off the global cooldown. Max 2 stacks.

This gives you a free oGCD Clemency every minute, with the first one being available after 30 seconds.

[Rithy255]

Except you're never in any scenario where you need to actually halt DPS to pump Clemency. Not in any kind of content that actually matters.

And solo content doesn't matter, anyway, because other tanks are better at soloing stuff than PLD is, WAR especially. I think y'all are dramatically underestimating how much healing over time the combo finishers are... which PLD doesn't get. If PLD needs any added healing, it's on Royal Authority (or Atonement, I guess?)

Are you aware PLD gets healing for every magic attack cast or not...? PLD has too much rotational healing if anything, I want PLD's to have more control over their self healing.

Edit: (Espon)
That would actually be a good change generally I'd really love something like that, It's also done in a way that doesn't make oath gauge some "clemency gauge".

[Espon]

Are you aware PLD gets healing for every magic attack cast or not...? PLD has too much rotational healing if anything, I want PLD's to have more control over their self healing.

Pretty sure he doesn't even raid outside of normal modes. He's said several incorrect things so far and judging by his post history he just goes into random threads to troll people.

[Rithy255]

Pretty sure he doesn't even raid outside of normal modes. He's said several incorrect things so far and judging by his post history he just goes into random threads to troll people.

Makes sense to me :/ can't say that I had good interactions.

Again I think your changes are a perfect example of best of both worlds, we don't have to compromise clemencies more niche side, being a on demand heal (even if it isn't optimal) and it becomes a ability that is also often more used, I now wish you were in charge of pld changes (unironically, looking back at your og post i pretty much agree with everything you said)