Can Someone Please Clarify What Sage's Eukrasian Diagnosis Does

[Pintsized]

So, at first glance this is an obvious "stupid question" as the tooltip for the skill seems perfectly clear:

"Restores target's HP.
Cure potency 300
Additional Effect: Erects a magicked barrier which nullifies damage equalling 125% of the HP restored ..."

So to me is says if I cast it on a party member and they get, say, 100 HP back they'll get a shield which will absord 125HP. Makes perfect sense, right?

BUT .. and this is where my confusion arises .. during the initial solo instance you get from the Sage role quest NPC, at the point you get to fight the first 'boss' the tutorial script tells you to cast "Eukrasian Diagnosis" on the NPC to 'shield him when first engaging' .. and the script blocks progress until you do this to reinforce the point; nostalgia for Stoneskin returns /sigh.

At this stage the NPC is at full health so the spell restores ZERO HP, so what use is the shield he gets since according to the tooltip it will nullify ZERO damage, or is the tutorial misleading having you cast it pre-battle giving the IMPRESSION it will do anything when the NPC is first attacked?

As I see it for the shield to absorb any HP the tooltip must be simply badly worded when it says "... if the amount of HP restored ..." .. if that isn't the case how does the shield provide any absorption without first having restored HP?

Cheers

[edit]

I looked in the Battle Log to see what that tells me about the application of the skill, it shows when the party member GETs the buff, but there's no log line for when it's removed so I can't see any battle action that causes it to drop even though the buff icon disappears during the battle!

[Mortex]

So, at first glance this is an obvious "stupid question" as the tooltip for the skill seems perfectly clear:

"Restores target's HP.
Cure potency 300
Additional Effect: Erects a magicked barrier which nullifies damage equalling 125% of the HP restored ..."

So to me is says if I cast it on a party member and they get, say, 100 HP back they'll get a shield which will absord 125HP. Makes perfect sense, right?

BUT .. and this is where my confusion arises .. during the initial solo instance you get from the Sage role quest NPC, at the point you get to fight the first 'boss' the tutorial script tells you to cast "Eukrasian Diagnosis" on the NPC to 'shield him when first engaging' .. and the script blocks progress until you do this to reinforce the point; nostalgia for Stoneskin returns /sigh.

At this stage the NPC is at full health so the spell restores ZERO HP, so what use is the shield he gets since according to the tooltip it will nullify ZERO damage, or is the tutorial misleading having you cast it pre-battle giving the IMPRESSION it will do anything when the NPC is first attacked?

As I see it for the shield to absorb any HP the tooltip must be simply badly worded when it says "... if the amount of HP restored ..." .. if that isn't the case how does the shield provide any absorption without first having restored HP?

Cheers

[edit]

I looked in the Battle Log to see what that tells me about the application of the skill, it shows when the party member GETs the buff, but there's no log line for when it's removed so I can't see any battle action that causes it to drop even though the buff icon disappears during the battle!

You don’t need too heal dmg with the spell to apply the shield. Any overheal works the same. It’s the same with scholar. It says HP restored not healed.

[Risvertasashi]

So if your heal lands for 10,000 HP, your target also gets a shield of 12,500 HP.

So to me is says if I cast it on a party member and they get, say, 100 HP back they'll get a shield which will absord 125HP. Makes perfect sense, right?

There are games that work like this but FF14 isn't one of them. So the above remains true even if that target is at 100% health, because the heal is still 10,000 HP even if only 100hp or no hp are missing. Perhaps the tooltip wording could be better, and in the past it's been an issue with for example Dark Knight (where only applied healing was measured). But for here and like 99% of the game, think of it as being uncapped.

[MintnHoney]

It's because they intend to bring accuracy back as a healer-specific mechanic, and so there will eventually be a chance for all of our healing to miss on each individual target. It means that some party members are going to die to the incoming raid-wide attack no matter how hard you try, naturally resulting in the clown fiesta many of us refer to as the high point in the healer experience at this time.

No, just kidding, it's just weird wording, like these two have said.

[AnotherPerson]

So, at first glance this is an obvious "stupid question" as the tooltip for the skill seems perfectly clear:

"Restores target's HP.
Cure potency 300
Additional Effect: Erects a magicked barrier which nullifies damage equalling 125% of the HP restored ..."

So to me is says if I cast it on a party member and they get, say, 100 HP back they'll get a shield which will absord 125HP. Makes perfect sense, right?

BUT .. and this is where my confusion arises .. during the initial solo instance you get from the Sage role quest NPC, at the point you get to fight the first 'boss' the tutorial script tells you to cast "Eukrasian Diagnosis" on the NPC to 'shield him when first engaging' .. and the script blocks progress until you do this to reinforce the point; nostalgia for Stoneskin returns /sigh.

At this stage the NPC is at full health so the spell restores ZERO HP, so what use is the shield he gets since according to the tooltip it will nullify ZERO damage, or is the tutorial misleading having you cast it pre-battle giving the IMPRESSION it will do anything when the NPC is first attacked?

As I see it for the shield to absorb any HP the tooltip must be simply badly worded when it says "... if the amount of HP restored ..." .. if that isn't the case how does the shield provide any absorption without first having restored HP?

The wording is mainly to imply how the shielding scales off the healing value. If Eukrasian Diagnosis heal 100 HP, then the shield value will be scaled based on the amount of HP that value is, which in this case, would be 125 shield, not the amount of HP it heals up.

In contrast, skills like Haima, Panhaima, and Gobskin work slightly differently because it "erects a magical barrier that absorbs damage equivalent to [X] potency". It applies a flat shield value, regardless of whether healing is disabled.
Unlike Eukrasian Diagnosis, which is "Erects a magical barrier which nullifies damage equaling to [X]% of the amount of HP restored"

This is only apparent for situations which disable healing (The Great Hunt Trial). If you heal 0 (or miss a heal back when accuracy was a thing), then even if the shield is 125% of the potency, 0 HP x 1.25 is still 0. However, because Haima, Panhaima, and Gobskin are all just 'shields', they get the full shield value applied to the target.

[Rongway]

I looked in the Battle Log to see what that tells me about the application of the skill, it shows when the party member GETs the buff, but there's no log line for when it's removed so I can't see any battle action that causes it to drop even though the buff icon disappears during the battle!

Do you have log messages for

Battle
Subject>Friendly NPCs
Beneficial effects on friendly NPCs ending.

turned off? If you can see the application message but not the removal message this is probably the issue.

[Doc_Seraph]

Kupo <3 I believe WoW resto druids back in the day had this issue with healing 'hots' at full health and healing arithmetic etc.. kupo <3

[Fyrebrand]

It's because they intend to bring accuracy back as a healer-specific mechanic, and so there will eventually be a chance for all of our healing to miss...

No, just kidding...

You had me going for a moment there, ha ha! I was almost like:

[Pintsized]

Many thanks for all the replies.

As is now clear, I read the words and as some of you pointed out the concept of "overheal" simply isn't mentioned and while I understand what that is I had no reason to infer that, this is the first time I think I've seen in any game where the excess heal actually is USED for something and not simply ignored.

Thanks!

[Rongway]

the concept of "overheal" simply isn't mentioned and while I understand what that is I had no reason to infer that, this is the first time I think I've seen in any game where the excess heal actually is USED for something and not simply ignored.

Here's how I make assumptions about whether overheal is ignored. Suppose someone is missing 5 HP and someone casts a 10,000 HP heal on them.

If I'm playing a game where the flytext or combat log say they regained 10,000 HP, the additional effects should work based on that 10,000 HP value including the overheal.

If I'm playing a game where the flytext or combat log say they regained 5 HP, the additional effects should be based on actual HP restored only.