The Problem with Healer Feedback, and requested changes

[Renathras]

Interesting.

Honestly, I like GNB more now, but that's more a button bloat issue. Gnashing Fang's combo being multiple buttons was always weird to me playing it in ShB. If Assize had a 15 sec CD, would you be content with that?

I think with SGE people were expecting something like a RIFT Chloromancer or (to a lesser example) WoW Disc Priest. Chloros were basically mages where their damage spells were weaker and they did splash and party member heals and the like. Like if you took PvP SGE and made it into a full class. I think people were imagining something like that when Yoshi P's statement was correct. SGE is what it says on the tin "It heals by doing damage". It also heals by weaving oGCDs, but it does damage and this generates heals. People just thought "doing damage" meant "has a somewhat involved DPS rotation" instead of "presses one spam button, refreshes a nuke, and occasionally use a melee range damage button".

...completely understandable, but Yoshi P wasn't lying about it, and probably wasn't actively trying to mislead people. He seems genuinely confused why people would play a healer role when they want to deal damage, so maybe in his mind, he was thinking they want to attack enemies more than press healing buttons, and SGE rewards doing that with healing. (Pneuma you don't press for damage - it's damage neutral with Dosis - you press it for the AOE heal when you use Zoe. It's a MASSIVE AOE heal when Zoe empowered since it counts as a cast time heal instead of an oGCD. It feels like it should do big damage, what with being a massive laser and all...but it doesn't. XD)

However, the point here:

SGE was released as it is. People who jumped on it expecting an in depth damage rotation are no longer under that delusion. The ones who wanted something more involved seem to have moved back to SCH.

That is, SGE is already this. No one has any delusions of that. Why would that change? And why wouldn't that apply to a new healer?

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I do have to ask: Who do you think the "majority" are, in this scenario? Do you truly think, despite easy Jobs being the most played in the game, that the majority doesn't want easy Jobs despite gravitating to them?

Also: The identity of some existing Jobs is this, though. WHM, for example, as you note "simple healer, focus on powerful direct healing". How could they introduce a new healer with a stronger identity of that than even WHM? What would that Job even be? How could a new healer be described as "simple healer, focus on powerful direct healing" without that stepping on WHM's toes? ...not that that tends to matter when it comes to giving WHM abilities to other Jobs but not letting WHM have their toys, but the point still stands...

Say they introduced Chemist as an easy Job. Wouldn't that have you guys rushing to the cool new thing and saying it should be more complex because of lore or mechanics or precedent (the Mix command from FFX, having a magic gun weapon, etc) just the same?

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EDIT:

AOE Kardia is one of those augments because that fruit is so low hanging it's touching the floor

lol, I love this statement, and absolutely agree. You get a like for that alone.

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EDIT2:

Also aside: It occurs to me that I really hate DoTs - as I've mentioned before - but don't dislike non-DoT spells. For example, I like Plegma and Toxicon. Granted, neither are spamable. My only issue with Plegma is the range. It doesn't have to be 25y, but 10y would be nice, 6y just feels constraining like a pair of gloves a size too small.

There also seems to be a difference between number of buttons (because most of you in pitching proposals tend to include adding 3-5 new abilities (sometimes with removing heals to "make some room")) and "pressing button more often". For example, I don't consider pressing Fell Cleave 50 times to be "more complexity" (the only thing making it mildly complex is the gauge management, but if that's removed and we're just talking the spam, I don't consider that "added complexity"). One thing I like about SGE is the hotbar economy is as good as WHM. If something was done like making the potency of Misery 620 (2x Glare) but making each Lily use generate a Misery (so you could hit it once every 20 seconds), I wouldn't mind that at all. If anything, it would give WHM more mobility and slightly better MP economy. I feel like you guys would dislike that because it would lower the skill ceiling - lower damage Misery means less penalty for not fitting it into buff windows, and it would be come a "use on CD" button, basically, since you would use it every 20 sec to not overcap lilies. It would be a bit like a pocket Ruin 4, basically, just used every 20+/-19 sec instead of once per 60.

I figure you guys wouldn't care for that, but I'd personally be fine with that change and not see it as adding complexity so much as being a side-grade - you'd hit the button 3x as often, with a lower skill ceiling, and it would make WHM more freely able to move about the cabin.

In other words, would that be "more complexity"? I wouldn't think so, but considering someone mentioned how many times buttons are pressed as an argument, and someone else sees Phlegma (a GCD) as distinct from Assize (an oGCD) despite them having the same CD and being used on average the same number of times in the fight, I'm curious if that would count.

(Note that this isn't a proposal, per se, just wondering how "complexity" vs "simplicity" are actually being defined by all of us. It's possibly the reason there's confusion among you vs my stance on Aero 3 when I don't mind Aero 3 as basically "a slightly more often pressed than Misery second button in AOE".)