Anyone else holding out hope for Machinist?

[DefectiveMuse]

Hey all,

Just came back to the game recently after being out since early 2020 or so.

I've seen that there's been a LOT of changes since I left. I've been trying to get through the MSQ for once so I haven't actually been doing any of my classes that need leveling, so I haven't tested several of them for myself yet.

My question today is this:

Is there any hope for MCH right now? I really liked that class and if the forums and the class balance I've encountered in-game are to be believed, MCH is dead right now due to unsustainable GCD choices by the devteam.

There's a live letter tomorrow covering the next patch...does anyone think we might get news about a fix? Or does that kind of thing only come with the whole-number patches? (eg: 6.0, 7.0, etc.)

[Zsolen]

They haven't fixed MCH since they destroyed in in 4.0.

I'm not saying people are willing or should be willing to do HW style MCH, but a demi-caster like in pvp is probably more suitable in pve. I think SE got that backwards.

[DefectiveMuse]

They haven't fixed MCH since they destroyed in in 4.0.

I'm not saying people are willing or should be willing to do HW style MCH, but a demi-caster like in pvp is probably more suitable in pve. I think SE got that backwards.

Then I guess I've only played it since it was 'destroyed'...

[CKNovel]

Then I guess I've only played it since it was 'destroyed'...

Yes, you only played broken iteration.
Stormblood could've been the best if it wasn't for this cubbersome heatgauge and Flamethrower.

ShB has taken a very good direction with Drill and Air Anchor, the uses of "machines" and its newfound thematic, but consider all that was lost:
-Wildfire Combo turned into a mindless heatblast spam.
-Interactive turret turned into a mindless robot.
-Ammos just gone to be replaced with a mindless battery gauge you'll mindlessly spend every 60s.
-All the remove support to never be replaced with anything.

MCH gained good things but lost a lot that was making it gameplay satisfying and valuable to the team.
I believe they can do great thing continuing with ShB iteration but EW dug the grave of the Automaton Queen with Crown collider and the kit got nothing but the disappointing Chain saw.

It's really amazing that they managed to make the job a disaster in PvE but somehow managed to make it enjoyable in PvP.

[Fendred]

Then I guess I've only played it since it was 'destroyed'...

Actually, its better now than it was then. There were hardly any machinists being played in Stormblood until the rework because it was just incredibly punishing to play.

[Mayhemmer]

They haven't fixed MCH since they destroyed in in 4.0.

MCH was unironically my favorite DPS job by the end of Stormblood, though I wish I had put more time into in HW. Was it weird and confusing to learn? Yeah, sure. Did it underperform? I'm told it did, but I never raided, so it's not like I cared much about that part.

The more I compare StB MCH to it's current iteration, the more I miss it. Most of the setup to it's wildfire window has been gutted and simplified since then. Learning how to manage heat and ammo and CD's back then to more efficiently squeeze damage out of those windows were what made it fun and engaging for me. It felt rewarding knowing I was doing it better every time. Now, I just press two buttons for the same effect.

I imagine most other people mainly want to discuss it's balance issues, but personally, I just miss old MCH. It's so boring to me now...

[RokkuEkkusu]

They haven't fixed MCH since they destroyed in in 4.0.

I'm not saying people are willing or should be willing to do HW style MCH, but a demi-caster like in pvp is probably more suitable in pve. I think SE got that backwards.

The irony is that people criticized the cast times of the physical ranged dps back in HW. Double irony is when both BRD and MCH became meta in the last Alexander Savage raid tier, even with having those cast times.

And when both BRD and MCH lost the cast times, MCH ultimately got the short end of the stick.

[Ceridwen]

I am - I don't think it would be that hard to improve it, even without drastic changes. More than increased damage, just making it more interesting to play. Its ocds aren't particularly interesting - those could use improvement. The autoturrett/queen could do SOMETHING other than just be there. Buff the party, buff ME - anything. Let me command the annoying thing! Let it explode dramatically in a big way rather than just, "eh, just ran out of steam - boom-ish..." It could get a bit more gadgety.

It's not just damage - it needs more flourish and choices, or more to do. But it doesn't seem like it needs an overhaul. Not a 'subtract,' more of an 'add some stuff.' Unlike classes that are packed & could use subtraction - this is in a good place in that regard.

[AluneTempest]

As i see, a lot of people dont have any hope on SE to do a good ''balance'' on the jobs, every patch is the same thing, jobs becoming 2 minute burst meta (PLD is the next), fun skills being removed and jobs become more and more homogenized.
On top of that now we have the ''damage taxes'' direction from the dev team, so people are just giving up on MCH.

PvP job direction and identity feels so much better than PvE.

[dspguy]

As i see, a lot of people dont have any hope on SE to do a good ''balance'' on the jobs, every patch is the same thing, jobs becoming 2 minute burst meta (PLD is the next), fun skills being removed and jobs become more and more homogenized.

Part of the homogeneity is a chicken and the egg thing. Back in the earlier raid days, players started to find that the secret to pushing DPS to clear this content was lining up certain abilities (Chain, Trick Attack, Battle Litany, etc). So the players gravitated towards certain jobs. As the "meta" moved players in that direction, other players didn't want to be forced to have their raid groups designed around some magical combination, so they complained. SE's solution was to simply make more jobs fit those burst windows. And as more jobs fit those burst windows, players that still didn't fit that cried out since they were excluded.

In the end, we have the vast majority of jobs feeling a bit homogenous because of the playerbase's need for balance.

Raiding aside, look what happened a few expansions ago. Mages used to be the kings of dungeons for AOE purposes. Physical DPS (tanks included) had TP limitations. Other physical DPS didn't have many AOE abilities at all since they were tuned to do more damage on single-target. What was the solution? Kill TP and give physical DPS plenty of AOE abilities.

I play a lot of jobs in this game. My tank hotbars are nearly identical. The 1-2-3 rotation goes here, the 1-2 AOE rotation goes there. The mitigation abilities go there. The "use my gauge" stuff goes there. Physical DPS is similar. 1-2-3 rotation there, 1-2 AOE over there. DPS buffs up there. "Use gauge stuff" over there. The rotations are similar (not the same). The only real difference is if you want to truly maximize a job's capabilities, you need to be more precise with the rotation and learn them perfectly for each job. But you can get 90% of the way there just using a hotbar template for other similar jobs.