What would the path be had you been able to contain the light?

[SannaR]

He's just an old man, cranky after being woken up too soon from his nap.

Does make me wonder if this is the first time he's been woken up after completing one of his duties, and that's why he's not handling it well at all.

Woken up soon after he completed one of his duties? Probably. As I'm going to assume he didn't have a hand in any of the 6th rejoining. None of the three nations that played a hand in that calamity at least on the source seem to fit his style. Either with how they operate or their aesthetics. That and the side story made it seem that he was only awoken when the other two +/- any sundered couldn't work with whatever nation(s) the current civilization was giving them to work with. But yes you could definitely see his being awoken by Elidibus as someone who'd just been napping for five minutes before being rudely woken up by someone or their pet.

[RyuDragnier]

I think this is also a little bit of a mischaracterization. Emet constantly says things that jeopardize his attempts to befriend and/or manipulate the Scions, snapping and getting hostile just as they're starting to lower their guard and trust him (relatively), the best example being when he drops the "moral relativity" line. The Scions are still feeling a bit more positive towards him because of his saving Y'shtola, and are the point where they're willing to at least hear him out and entertain empathizing with his motive, but he spoils it and sours the atmosphere to no gain.

He's not some master manipulator, at least not at that point. He's contradictory because he can't control his own emotions and fundamentally has no idea what he even wants.

I think this plays into why the playerbase likes Emet so much. He's a deep and complex character, and is conflicted. He got the most human treatment out of all of the Ascians, and made him feel like somebody you can sympathize with easily. The lives of him and those he cared about were basically burned into the ground, and he has been in a constant flux of grieving stages. It feels like over the course of ShB we see him fluctuate between several of the stages, before finally hitting Acceptance after the final battle with him.

[Lyth]

Emet's 'nap' is pretty short, and is effectively only for the duration of ARR. After he dies at the age of 88, five years after the most recent Calamity, he lets himself float in the rift. We see his casket on Varis' first appearance in ARR. The short story 'Tales from the Shadows: Ere Our Curtain Falls' has him woken up from his sleep by Elidibus to reveal that Lahabrea has been destroyed, which places this scene just after the Heavensward Main Scenario. We don't know who was directly involved with the War of the Magi, but I'm sure that we'll get some more information around this as the story around the Void is expanded on. I wonder if some of the later Variant dungeons in this patch series (set #2/#3) will delve into topics around Nym/Amdapor as well.

I think that Emet's popularity comes from that Snape effect, so it's not really unexpected. Seeing him hand over his grudging approval in Elpis essentially clinched the deal. But most of the characters in this game are written in a way that you can sympathize with them, if you're willing to do so. I personally like it better that way.

[Cleretic]

I think this plays into why the playerbase likes Emet so much. He's a deep and complex character, and is conflicted. He got the most human treatment out of all of the Ascians, and made him feel like somebody you can sympathize with easily. The lives of him and those he cared about were basically burned into the ground, and he has been in a constant flux of grieving stages. It feels like over the course of ShB we see him fluctuate between several of the stages, before finally hitting Acceptance after the final battle with him.

Also because he's unconventionally hot (but not too unconventionally hot), and a type of evil where he simultaneously feels like he has a point but he could also maybe possibly be convinced to not do the horrible thing.

Emet appeals to people who want a quirky sexy man, the people who want a guy they can fix, and the people who want to agree with the evil guy, while somehow managing to remain generally consistent, charismatic, sympathetic and detailed as a character at the end of it all. He's checking more 'character appeal' boxes than I genuinely thought were even possible to check with the one character in the one piece of media; MCU Loki took like, five movies and a miniseries to get this far. Snape's a good comparison, too.

I don't like him, and I remember being very surprised when I learned I was basically alone about that after finishing Shadowbringers; it was very alienating to bring my fresh opinion of 'well most of that was great, shame the ending dropped the ball' to people after finishing and getting 'confusion bordering on anger' as a response. But stepping back and taking a wider look at it... yeah, I can see exactly why I didn't find much agreement there.

[Jandor]

I don't like him, and I remember being very surprised when I learned I was basically alone about that after finishing Shadowbringers; it was very alienating to bring my fresh opinion of 'well most of that was great, shame the ending dropped the ball' to people after finishing and getting 'confusion bordering on anger' as a response. But stepping back and taking a wider look at it... yeah, I can see exactly why I didn't find much agreement there.

Emet: Remember us, remember that we once lived.

Me, turning to the Scions: Check out the absolute cheek o' this fella, not 2 seconds ago he was ranting about expunging us from histories weave.

[Ralphe2449]

Emet appeals to people who want a quirky sexy man, the people who want a guy they can fix

Oh no, I am strictly in the "i can make him worse" category

I've said this before, but I think the most critical thing to understand about Emet in Shadowbringers is that he's not behaving rationally.

I agree he isnt rational, he is both tired and clearly has a degree of attachment to Azem no matter their disagreements, it is clear the reason he approaches the scions at Shb is because he show the hue of your soul and suddenly thought Azem could somehow lead to a different solution.

It is clear Emet himself hopes for an easier alternative since like I said, scheming to achieve so many rejoinings by itself takes a ridiculous amount of time and effort so even just from that practical aspect all would wish for a better solution without even mentioned as you say his contradictory behavior which are just contradictory beliefs and experiences.
His plan at the end of shadowbringers was to find a way to learn how the exarch figured out time travel because that would easily create new possibilities and you dont have to think hard about said possibilities, it is why I am imagining he at least has an inkling of an idea what a light surviving WoL could do to help bring back the ancients.

He becomes completely honest when he "betrays" the group when you kill Vauthry, he literally screams to Alphinaud "I was genuinely thinking of taking you on as allies" had the guy with Azem's soul been able to hold the light, he GENUINELY believed it could be possible, even if it was not, Emet, an unsundered with great arcane knowledge believed it could have been possible so I wouldnt say it is out of the realm of possibility and an unsundered or Azem at least wouldnt be able to handle the light.


The other option would be that knowing Azem he had hoped that Azem himself would be able to find a better solution hence if you could handle the light like possibly Azem could, you could prove his equal and he could "trust" Azem in finding a better solution which imo doesnt make much sense unless Azem was that good at finding unorthodox solutions Emet never could.

And it is quite clear he knows you have azem's soul since he specifically mentions your soul when he first sees you and later on Hythlodeus in amaurot mentions that there's no way Emet missed the hue of your soul.

[SaberMaxwell]

Makes me eager to get to my ShB replay because I could swear the implication was "if you pass the test I'll invite you aboard team ascian. If you refuse the invite, well its a shame but I'll kill you anyway."

[Ralphe2449]

Makes me eager to get to my ShB replay because I could swear the implication was "if you pass the test I'll invite you aboard team ascian. If you refuse the invite, well its a shame but I'll kill you anyway."

Replaying it right now

He definitely does not give such an ultimatum, from the beginning he is quite honest, he knows you are part of Azem's soul and that makes him decide reaching out in the POSSIBILITY that common ground/"a path of less tragedy" exists had you proven powerful enough to contain the light. Now how that could lead to a new path is the question of this thread, had you proven you are equal to him even sundered shows little, after all Zenos with factory made echo made Elidibus run away, and considering Emet in the first says he has taken the body of some rando and made it into himself he is also subject to the same weakening effect as elidibus taking the body of Zenos so I cant imagine their power level is that different.
Like I feel there is something more than "Oh you are just as powerful, ok we might find a way to work together" because such a thought leads to nowhere, allying with someone equally powerful does not unlock new possibilities unless Azem is that special.

Had no common path been found he would of course kill you as he says, but the choice was never "Join or die"


Regarding the notion that the shards still need to be rejoined even if the original ancients are reborn, I just kinda realized something, Ardbert was dead and was easily able to rejoin with us, considering how utterly mortal sundered are, what stops the unsundered from just waiting them to die and then just rejoining with each when once they are dead.

The inevitable death due to the mortal nature of the sundered is an easy escape if it is possible. After all what is easier, to orchestrate hundred year plans to achieve multiple calamities or just slowly rejoining each sundered ascian when their sundered pieces in each shard dies.

[Cleretic]

Oh no, I am strictly in the "i can make him worse" category

Pretty sure you fall under the 'want to side with the evil guy' category rather than the first two (Well, rather than the second category; I'm pretty sure you think he's hot), you're just adding a couple extra steps.

But good to learn that the reason you pre-emptively vetoed the 'Ascians are evil' argument wasn't because you thought that wouldn't be constructive, relevant, or welcome, but because you thought they were too moderate. I admit, I didn't see that coming.

[jameseoakes]

Also because he's unconventionally hot (but not too unconventionally hot), and a type of evil where he simultaneously feels like he has a point but he could also maybe possibly be convinced to not do the horrible thing.

Emet appeals to people who want a quirky sexy man, the people who want a guy they can fix, and the people who want to agree with the evil guy, while somehow managing to remain generally consistent, charismatic, sympathetic and detailed as a character at the end of it all. He's checking more 'character appeal' boxes than I genuinely thought were even possible to check with the one character in the one piece of media; MCU Loki took like, five movies and a miniseries to get this far. Snape's a good comparison, too.

I don't like him, and I remember being very surprised when I learned I was basically alone about that after finishing Shadowbringers; it was very alienating to bring my fresh opinion of 'well most of that was great, shame the ending dropped the ball' to people after finishing and getting 'confusion bordering on anger' as a response. But stepping back and taking a wider look at it... yeah, I can see exactly why I didn't find much agreement there.

People liked him as he was a interesting well written character, we could feel what that weight of the duty he held himself to do and the damage the monstrous acts he has and continues to do have done to him and he was an actual well written example of depression as we can feel just how broken and depressed he really is. He was also an genuinely interesting and fun character to be around which made the knowledge that would have to come to ahead extra sad. He also came with a very relatable story, how much would we damn ourselves to bring back the people we love as it made him a very relatable villain.