The Devs need a much needed thanks!

[Striker44]

Okay but this is also a place for discussion and feedback, not the dev congratulations echo chamber

Making counter threads whenever controversy happens is just white knighting and helps nobody

Not necessarily. Especially when you consider how some people here consider the simple number of pages a thread has as an indication of how much "support" the initial thought has (rather than acknowledging it could be a thorough discussion with people on both sides). It's not "white knighting" at all to make one post about a topic saying you enjoy it in a forum surrounded by a bunch of other negative posts. Positive feedback is feedback, too. Or is that the plan? Say "this should be about criticism, anybody posting positive things is just a shill" then saying "see there's only negative posts here, the devs are horrible and should change everything they do." There's no honesty there. It might not help the perpetual naysayers to see people posting positive comments, but it does in fact help everyone to show that said naysayers aren't the norm among the wider playerbase.

Frankly, it amuses me to see how the same people will claim there are all of these other sites that are utterly and completely intolerant of any negative comments about the game, just filled with oodles of people praising the devs, and how these forums are the only place where one can post negative comments...and then in the next breath claim that the negative comments from our few dozen or so folks here are somehow massively representative of the wider community and should be taken as the norm.

It's actually quite telling that even with the echo chamber here, the naysayers can't even allow one positive topic to exist without coming in and trying to passively-aggressively disrupt it or take it down. It's sad that people are so negative, they can't even accept other people having fun. That's when it's time to step back, take a break, and realize one might just be taking a game too seriously.

[ameliaw]

It's actually quite telling that even with the echo chamber here, the naysayers can't even allow one positive topic to exist without coming in and trying to passively-aggressively disrupt it or take it down. It's sad that people are so negative, they can't even accept other people having fun. That's when it's time to step back, take a break, and realize one might just be taking a game too seriously.

You do realize that the OP lowkey insults people who are complaining about the balance, right?

[Supersnow845]

Not necessarily. Especially when you consider how some people here consider the simple number of pages a thread has as an indication of how much "support" the initial thought has (rather than acknowledging it could be a thorough discussion with people on both sides). It's not "white knighting" at all to make one post about a topic saying you enjoy it in a forum surrounded by a bunch of other negative posts. Positive feedback is feedback, too. Or is that the plan? Say "this should be about criticism, anybody posting positive things is just a shill" then saying "see there's only negative posts here, the devs are horrible and should change everything they do." There's no honesty there. It might not help the perpetual naysayers to see people posting positive comments, but it does in fact help everyone to show that said naysayers aren't the norm among the wider playerbase.

Frankly, it amuses me to see how the same people will claim there are all of these other sites that are utterly and completely intolerant of any negative comments about the game, just filled with oodles of people praising the devs, and how these forums are the only place where one can post negative comments...and then in the next breath claim that the negative comments from our few dozen or so folks here are somehow massively representative of the wider community and should be taken as the norm.

It's actually quite telling that even with the echo chamber here, the naysayers can't even allow one positive topic to exist without coming in and trying to passively-aggressively disrupt it or take it down. It's sad that people are so negative, they can't even accept other people having fun. That's when it's time to step back, take a break, and realize one might just be taking a game too seriously.

A positive topic is fine and you’ll see past positive topics are always well received, a positive topic that basically amounts to “don’t look at all those people complaining everything is fine UWU” is just stupid and a waste

I certainly couldn’t care less overall (I basically sit on these forums because I get enjoyment out of arguing I don’t really care about the topic it’s not like I actually get angry or involved over it) but it’s just funny that people have had 4 months to praise the devs (6.1 was well received) but not gotta wait till the community on here gets angry then throw the UWU bomb

[Theodric]

It's actually quite telling that even with the echo chamber here, the naysayers can't even allow one positive topic to exist without coming in and trying to passively-aggressively disrupt it or take it down. It's sad that people are so negative, they can't even accept other people having fun. That's when it's time to step back, take a break, and realize one might just be taking a game too seriously.

I think the people who don't want that to happen probably should have thought twice about coming into threads committed to compile criticism and feedback only to go off on lengthy tangents about how the game is fine and exceedingly popular and that any opposition exists solely in the form of a vocal minority.

Kind of like how the people tired of Venat being criticised and held accountable probably should not have spent months or years declaring loudly that there was never, ever an excuse or justification for genocide only to change their tune as soon as their precious 'mOmMy GoDdEsS' became complicit in such acts herself.

[Axxion]

It's actually quite telling that even with the echo chamber here, the naysayers can't even allow one positive topic to exist without coming in and trying to passively-aggressively disrupt it or take it down. It's sad that people are so negative, they can't even accept other people having fun. That's when it's time to step back, take a break, and realize one might just be taking a game too seriously.

so my question to you is. what about those people that are emotionally invested into this? If you haven't notice 14 community is emotionally driven to a point other people call it a cult. Should we bring up the lazy peon problem? or quin?

I just want to point out that the critics aren't the ones telling you that you can NEVER be positive. All we're saying is that you should be positive when its the right time to be positive and SE does something you like, and that it's ok to be negative when it's the right time to be negative when SE screws up. On the other hand, you have the critic police out in full force, calling anyone who isn't overly positive a 'hater' that should be ignored by polite society.

Let me ask you this. Even if you disagree with me or others when we put forth criticism of something you like, what kind of culture do you want for the forums?

A forums where we are allowed to be honest, and both positivity and negativity have a place? A place where opinions can be shared freely?

Or a social media website like Twitter or Reddit where only one side of the debate is allowed? Where one side of the debate encompasses everything and anything to the contrary is silenced and expelled?

Do you REALLY want people like Silverbane to be the dictators of discussion?

Truth be told i rather people be honest.

And beside everybody know what twitter is mainly used for and that for all the nsfw ff content

the OP did word things rather poorly for their intent (or was their intent to start this mess)

also seems to be a huge disconnect between "praise" and "thanks"

I enjoy the game, so gave thanks for that, praise is a different story. there are flaws and while one can only assume they are working on them, I dont see a lot of areas for outright praise as being done in a really noteworthy way. those definitions are not equal, as some seem to think.

here is the thing in which alot of people always forget. if you like something you can criticize it. I love 14, this one of my favorite mmo and the one that ill return to. However i do see the flaws in it. Like yoshi p said takes breaks. Me taking those breaks always want to suggest them to add more to 14. Other games to it better but why cant 14 take those ideas and put there own spin on it?

[IkaraGreydancer]

Okay but this is also a place for discussion and feedback, not the dev congratulations echo chamber

Making counter threads whenever controversy happens is just white knighting and helps nobody

Thanking the devs IS feedback though. So stop with the double standard dude. This is exactly what I was talking about earlier. The fact you just call it "congratulations echo chambering" says alot

[Axxion]

To give a reminder that most people playing the game really enjoy it, and acknowledgment that the forum community is the smallest minuscule piece of sand on the beach that is the playerbase? It's more reflective of the popularity of FFXIV than anything else - there's simply so many people loving the game right now that even the few among them who spend their time on the forums are speaking up instead of just letting the ever-present echo chamber of negativity go unchallenged.

that is the most crazy thing to say. people are enjoying it which is fine but what about the issues that they having? Place it on the fourm. and beside if you think complaining is bad then stop playing a male miqote then. They never was playable until after a AAR due to people complaining

Now to the topic. There are so much to unpack. What a lot of this boils down to is not blindly praise anything. Take meta critic on the day after post of ender walker as a good example . You praise when things are good, when things are bad we provide feed back. we don't just make a post to counter something and then try to say that that only 2% don't even know what they are talking about.

While as we legit always try to do that but you know what? many people including yourself are the same one to shut down criticism. Take drk and living dead. People actually thought that was the best invul in game and it was planned. I can count how many time that i died because i planned using it and still died because of the healer does not know how it works. After years it finally got fixed after yoshi p said him self that he was not aware that this was an issue.



Yoshi and his team gets a lot of praise no matter what. When another game does bad, game journalist will always reference aar as a example to fix there game. This is a staple for alot. When he was at e3 i think? a lot of people cheered him on because of what he did to 14

We know they can do better, we want them to do better. As it stand they becoming to complacent. Not going to sugar code it. I do understand that yoshi himself is taking another part as helping to develop the new ff entry.

We get tired of the same thing and things not being updated. Like apartments , like the characters, housing, glamour, squadrons etc. We bring these things up and guess what? many people will shut that down because they don't want to change.

We get tired of them not explaining the changes. As you can see they recently started doing this.

if you notice they add systems on top of systems that they never go back to update.

feedback to you is that you need to start asking questions to see why people upset.

[Lauront]

To give a reminder that most people playing the game really enjoy it, and acknowledgment that the forum community is the smallest minuscule piece of sand on the beach that is the playerbase?

Oh wow, they patched new lines into your script!

But Theodric... you're not respecting Striker's majoritah!!! You simply must remember that Endwalker was the 'most popular expansion ever' (TM) and that anyone who disagrees is in the minoritah, and thus must respect the factual opinions of those in the majoritah.

We are but grains of sand before Striker's Mt Majoritah.

[SentioftheHoukai]

To give a reminder that most people playing the game really enjoy it, and acknowledgment that the forum community is the smallest minuscule piece of sand on the beach that is the playerbase? It's more reflective of the popularity of FFXIV than anything else - there's simply so many people loving the game right now that even the few among them who spend their time on the forums are speaking up instead of just letting the ever-present echo chamber of negativity go unchallenged.

This comes off more to me as an overly verbose manner of telling those with potentially valid critiques to simply leave and not speak their minds. Not exactly conducive to good feedback if you ask me....

oh God, this is going to turn into a "woke" or "venat" thread isn't it?

Do you want it to? I can grant your wish, if you like....

[AwesomeJr44]

This comes off more to me as an overly verbose manner of telling those with potentially valid critiques to simply leave and not speak their minds. Not exactly conducive to good feedback if you ask me....

That's because that's exactly what it is.

Do you want it to? I can grant your wish, if you like....

Haha. I honestly feel like SannaR, MightyMollusk, and Boblawblah fear Venat threads more than everyone else wants them lol. Seriously, if you even mention the V word or the H word, they blow a gasket.