Paladin Redesign Theorycraft by Miyoru Utadaeshi

[Miyoru]

I am Miyoru Utadaeshi from Leviathan, a Paladin main who has been playing the job since the Alphascape raids in Stormblood.

Why Redesign?

In light of developer comments about Paladin buffs in patch 6.21, I thought it would be fun to come up with a concept for a new Paladin rotation that keeps the core identity of Paladin intact, while better aligning it with the standard 2 minute raid buff burst windows. For me, the core identity of Paladin is having a mix of GCD actions throughout a roughly 1minute loop. A job like Dark Knight mostly uses a stable 123 combo with occasional burst GCDs, Paladin has a combo with 2 finishers, Atonement, Holy Spirit, and Confiteor+blades combo.

Redesign Goals

In designing this new rotation, I had a few high level goals in mind that I wanted the rotation to follow:

• Fixed 60s rotation loop at 2.5s GCD.
• This is to better make PLD gear work with other jobs, and to avoid having weird rotation hiccups due to some actions being spells and therefore locked to 2.5s regardless of skillspeed. This results in a 60s loop of 24 actions
• Universal damage buff Fight or Flight.
• Right now, Paladin essentially has two burst phases, a strong one about 20s long in the form of Requiescat spell phase, and a 25s long physical burst phase from Fight or Flight. Because Paladin’s burst is spread out over 45s, it is unable to fit all of its high potency actions within the shorter raid buff windows of 15-30s. As a result, its overall damage is reduced compared to jobs which are able to fit most of their potency in the shorter raid buff window. By making FoF a universal damage buff, PLD could fit both its strong spells and physical oGCDs into the same buff window, concentrating more of its potency into one window, similar to many other jobs.
• More oGCDs in burst.
• A large source of Dark Knight and Gunbreaker being so effective in raid buffs is their higher number of oGCDs that they can pool and use under raid buffs. I believe shifting potency onto oGCDs is necessary for Paladin to have more concentrated burst windows without making their sustained damage too high and being overtuned.
• Maintain Damage over Time management.
• Although it’s true that dots do not work as well in fights where the boss becomes untargetable for a period, managing dots has been one of the core aspects of Paladin's identity since at least Stormblood. For this reason, I want to keep Goring Blade in the rotation in some way.

I've created a Google doc with the full write up, including images of the rotation and potency values that you can find here: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1...it?usp=sharing

I am open to any feedback. I'm pretty proud of this redesign concept, and would be happy if the Developers implemented some of these ideas.

Thanks for reading!

[Deo14]

I don't really like this rotation. Merging physical and magical phase feels so wrong. You might as well remove FoF completely and adjust potencies, no point in layering 2 buffs on top of each other. I get what you're getting at, this makes PLD viable for current 2min burst meta, but I would prefer if rotation was more or less same, just make it possible to use requiescat in burst window (other than 18s prepull, that is pretty cursed).

But my biggest gripe is all the double weaving. If you look at your example rotation, you weave oGCD attunements and intervene in between spells, which is obviously nonsense, you can't utilize spell's range when oGCDs are melee. So solution would be to cram all the oGCDs (2x intervene + expla + scorn + 3x attunement = 7 oGCDs + 1 more to active requiescat) into 3 melee GCDs. Even if you double weaved it all, you would end up using first holy spirit in melee. And honestly, all this oGCD spam starts feeling like mindless DRK button mash.

Problem could be solved without all these drastic changes. Just finally merge SkS with SpS to somewhat fix alignment and remove 1 GCD from loop (just remove 1 holy spirit). But I like the idea of making goring blade like GNBs sonic break. Without combo requirement and if it was not affected FoF, you could get opener with DoT as your first GCD and go straight into magic phase.

[Miyoru]

Merging of magic phase with melee oGCDs was done with current fight design in mind. The developers have shown that they are designing encounters with full melee uptime in mind. The most amount of time that disengages are ever required is about 1 GCD. My proposed rotation has 7 oGCDs for 10 GCD windows in the opener, and 9 oGCDs for 10 GCD windows from 1m onwards. These can easily be weaved earlier on, leaving up to 5 GCDs of ranged attacks on the high end. This would be more than enough ranged attacks for full uptime on every modern encounter. As for overlapping FoF and Requiescat, a large reason why PLD underperforms right now is that its burst is too spread out. 45s of burst (25s of FoF, 20s of magic actions) is too long for the raid buffs in this game. The only way to make PLD work with current burst design is to shorten it's burst duration. "Overlapping" FoF with requiescat is the way I went about doing this. In addition, many jobs overlap their damage buffs. Dragoon comes to mind as a job which does this.

I can understand disliking oGCD spam, but I think that is the only way to allow for pooling potency for burst windows without making the rest of the rotation overpowered. It also reduces reliance upon crit RNG by having potency spread out over more actions.

I believe merging sks and sps would be a good change to make, but I don't expect the developers would make that change mid-expansion, and I think they would consider the merging/removal of a substat a more drastic change than changing the rotation of one job. That is why I ultimately didn't make use of that in my theorycraft, although I did consider it.

Thanks for your feedback!

[Sazuzaki]

I like this direction quite a bit. It's a shame we lose RoH in favor of RA.

I do have one thing that bothers me: Goring Blade and the RA combo are a bit too similar to GNB. I understand Goring Blade being on a 20 second CD would change it up a bit, but RA-combo being on a 30 second CD is a little too similar to GNB's Gnashing Fang. DRK already has too much of WAR's ideas, it would blow if PLD got some of GNB's ideas too leaving no tank truly unique.

I do like the ideas in here though! I would love to see Savage Blade make a come back, and seeing Shield Bash in there is pretty cool.

[Miyoru]

It is pretty similar to GNB you're right. It's a consequence of atonements being made into oGCDs. I needed a way to make atonements not come up all the time, and the way i came up with that was putting the combo that generates the stack on a CD. If they were generated another way, the CD on the combo could be removed. The shield bash combo would also be removed as a consequence though.

[Rithy255]

Looked at the documents and stuff, thinking about it this seems like a pretty decent rework if Paladin has to be reworked.

Not sure how I'd feel about PLD becoming more like Gunbreaker, I mean it's better then Paladin becoming a warrior. It's something I'd actually have to play through but I already enjoy gunbreaker so this would seem better then any sort of rework I can imagine happen, I would likely prefer current Paladin to this version, I don't really have any complaints with how current Paladin plays, but I understand it's struggling to output a strong burst as it's a sustained job, as my main complaints with PLD is actually it's defensives/utility isn't really currently that great, I do hope they make changes to that as well

I think I might enjoy this hypothetical version of PLD but I don't think it will be as good as current Paladins general rotational loop, It's a pretty good job compared to what a lot of people have thought up of, at least I know if "pld" is ruined I'd move to gunbreaker, so this kind of the 2nd best thing unless the SE rework generally somehow is more interesting then current PLD, but this still has a decent chunk of magic and melee which is what i really enjoy about PLD ascetically being a magic swordsman.

I think it has enough to feel different from gunbreaker but also at the same time you can clearly tell they'd play somewhat similar.

[caaam]

We have DRK and GNB as OGCD spammers already, and do not need a third while there are only four tanks. If you want to redesign things, adhere to what PLD currently is, or devise novel ideas. Each job should feel unique, even within a role. GNB works well, and it's great that people enjoy it, but other job concepts should exist for those who enjoy other types of game play. The game is better for it.

While it would be mildly amusing if PLD got a Scourge knock-off, Goring Blade being a combo finisher means you have to commit to it. There is a simple but engaging dichotomy between reapplying Goring, or going for more Atonements (e.g. boss is invulnerable/dead soon). Minor things like this raise the skill ceiling of a job without making it more difficult to achieve basic competency. Your version is just a button you press whenever it lights up. The 20 second cooldown means you could not even multi-DoT with it, unlike previous iterations of this type of skill. This idea succeeds in keeping DoT maintenance on PLD, but fails to be fun. The fun of DoTs is in their applications, not their maintenance. If you rolled all the potency of this DoT into flat damage on the skill, it would be almost exactly the same. If you feel DoT game play is a central aspect of PLD, then design something that is more than just flavor.

More subjectively, I quite like that PLD does not have a 1-2-3 filler combo. Filler of this sort is the antithesis of fun to me. When broken into groups of three (or four for magic), PLD never does the same thing twice in a basic rotation. I also enjoy DRG for this reason. Here's hoping we do get a proper shield attack in the future though.

Ultimately, unless the developers decide to reevaluate their stance on the game, PLD will be deleted, and something new will wear its name tag. I hope the new job is fun, and has a reasonable skill ceiling for those who want to get the most out of this game. If we are lucky, it may even resemble PLD too.

[SilverSkyway]

I don't want a ocgd spam job. A reason I went pally is because i'm not spamming. I also don't want button bloat job which Paladin feel like it could be next expansion if nothing is done.
I will agree Pally need qol. I think Atonement is pretty unsatisfying. Gore dot I think should be 30s. Why is it 21s? Aoe feel niche. I forget magic circle most time then not. HShellton should help vs dots. Intervention needs more. Maybe Paladin get 5% damage reduce if place on a party member whom gets the 10%+ still.

I don't care if the job get easier. I'm all for it and if the job stays the same I'll get used to it but again, Paladin needs qol; Be it a rework or damage buff (and delete Atonement).

Edit: I'm not saying the job need be easy per say as much I like it to be but it shouldn't like as it is now.

[Sqwall]

Personally, Fight or Flight is no longer a skill but a buff you get from Royal Authority when combo is complete. Lasts for 20 seconds.

Also

Atonement is now oGCD with 1s recast. Atonement refreshes Fight or Flight buff to max 20 seconds. (Each atonement refreshing should help with uptime if you peal off to long and keep you from drifting really bad, even though it's over kill to keep refreshing...so is 5 Edges during DRK's opener overlapping your darkness buff)

Now you can weave Atonment during your burst between 4 Holy Spirits or during your Confiteor Combo. This way your burst will always be under FoF buff (much like WAR,DRK) but you must maintain it with weaving atonement. Why paladin can't or could never weave atonement is beyond me (which it should have been able to do that since get go)

This way you can hold onto your atonement and delay them if you wish. Or if you peel off the boss...your still range with Holy Spirit spam or Blade Spam...either way you have 20 seconds to get back and get in the atonement to refresh Fight or Flight.

Fight or Flight is essentially relegated to a Darkness or Surging Tempest buff. This way Paladin has to sustain FoF Buff rather then time it perfectly every single 60 seconds. If paladin wishes to stay the sustain job and with a constant Fight or Flight buff, adjust potencies accordingly.

Basically every other Req burst is under raid buffs like it is now, but Paladin isn't held to an extremely rigid rotation hand cuffed to your fight or flight, and you can now weave atonement which increases Paladin overall damage during raid buffs.

Simple Opener to reopener.

Holy Spirit + Intervene (Prepull)
Fast Blade
Riot Blade
Potion
Royal Authority (x3 atonement charges, lasts 30seconds) (granted FoF Buff 20sec) + (weave)Request a cat

Fast Blade + (double weave)Espacion +Circle of Scorn
Riot Blade (weave) Intervene
Goring Blade
Holy Spirit + (weave)Atonement
Holy Spirit + (weave)Atonement
Holy Spirit + (weave)Atonement
Holy Spirit
Confiteor
Blade of Faith
Blade of Truth
Blade of Valor
Re-opener

Alternate Opener to reopener. (prolly won't get atonement under raid buffs)

Holy Spirit + Intervene (Prepull)
Fast Blade
Riot Blade
Potion
Royal Authority (x3 atonement charges, lasts 30seconds) (granted FoF Buff 20sec) + (weave)Request a cat

Fast Blade + (double weave)Espacion +Circle of Scorn
Riot Blade (weave) Intervene
Goring Blade + (weave)Atonement
Holy Spirit
Holy Spirit
Holy Spirit
Holy Spirit
Confiteor
Blade of Faith + (weave)Atonement
Blade of Truth + (weave)Atonement
Blade of Valor + (weave)Atonement
Re-opener

Whatever is used...the fact is this is MUCH more flexible and no longer puts the Paladin at risk of drifting out of raid buffs or missing Fight or Flight by 1 GCD and just being screwed. And it doesn't change the opener THAT much. Plus you won't have to use a 20second timer prepull for Fight or Flight alignment.

[Mikey_R]

Personally, Fight or Flight is no longer a skill but a buff you get from Royal Authority when combo is complete. Lasts for 20 seconds.

Also

Atonement is now oGCD with 1s recast. Atonement refreshes Fight or Flight buff to max 20 seconds...

Now you can weave Atonment during your burst between 4 Holy Spirits or during your Confiteor Combo. This way your burst will always be under FoF buff (much like WAR,DRK) but you must maintain it with weaving atonement. Why paladin can't or could never weave atonement is beyond me (which it should have been able to do that since get go)

...

Fight or Flight is essentially relegated to a Darkness or Surging Tempest buff. This way Paladin has to sustain FoF Buff rather then time it perfectly every single 60 seconds. If paladin wishes to stay the sustain job and with a constant Fight or Flight buff, adjust potencies accordingly.

...

Whatever is used...the fact is this is MUCH more flexible and no longer puts the Paladin at risk of drifting out of raid buffs or missing Fight or Flight by 1 GCD and just being screwed. And it doesn't change the opener THAT much. Plus you won't have to use a 20second timer prepull for Fight or Flight alignment.

But this doesn't actually address issues people has except the cursed opener, infact, it makes things worse. Away from the opener, you will have the usual Goring blade with 2 RA combos after. So, rather than dropping an atonement, as is done now to better line up raid buffs, you want to replace those 2 Atonements with a 3 GCD combo (because lets be honest, noone is going to pass up all that damage) which drifts the rotation further away than it already does. Further more, it is just alot of oGCD spam. Goring > Royal > Royal means that, after the first Royal, you have to use Atonement on every GCD before you use Royal again to not waste stacks and you have to do this twice every minute. You get some breathing room with Goring Blade and the magic phase, but it is still 12 oGCDs to use in the 60 seconds, which is on average, once every 5 seconds, or once every 2 GCDs. You will be more busy in the non magic phase than the actual burst phase itself. How does that make sense?

Add onto that the fact FoF basically becomes a non issue in upkeep. The only management you need to do is to make sure you use 1 Atonement just before Confiteor and it will never drop off (where you put it in your openers, FoF will drop off for at least 1 GCD), which is the only actual management you have, it might as well not exist at that point. At least DRK has to balance their MP usage so that they can keep Darkside going, or Warrior has to keep an eye out so that they can use a different combo, but this concept doesn't even have that.

On a separate note, if they merged SS and SS into one stat, PLD would still need a GCD of 2.3 seconds to fit everything in a 1 minute window (26 GCDs over 60 seconds). This would mean giving PLD a speed boost (would require an ~8% speed up) as well as a merging the 2 stats (or a trait that does the same thing), which I don't personally see them doing, but it would be interesting to have a quicker tank nonetheless.

Edit: With some thought, I can think of a way to make it work along with making PLD a speedy tank so that it can fit into the 1 minute burst windows. First, change FoF so that it is a damage and speed buff. If you then change Royal Authority so that it only gives 1 stack of Atonement, but allow it to stack up to 2 or 3 (undecided). With this simple change, every minute you will generate 4 Sword Oath stacks, 2 or 3 of which you can save for the burst phase, with the remaining one(s) being used whenever outside it. It is still a point to be made that FoF will basically never fall off except during the magic burst, however, with at least 2 Sword Oath stacks, you have a bit more flexibility in where you use them and you aren't tied to having it on a specific oGCD window, this is why I allowed stacking of the buff. Overall, I would suspect this is a nice balance between keeping the original idea intact but making it possibly feel better to play.