How to easily have healers dps engaged ( yet another thread)

[Renathras]

I mean if you don't really want to engage with a healer's rotation, if all the healers get a more developed rotation, why not just ignore the rotation and spam whatever button you want? It's not like it matters at all outside of savage anyway. You can always just not use Dia if you hate it that much.

This is something people like you will never understand.

People not wanting something to have a high skill feeling aren't necessarily people who don't try to do their best anyway. There's this weird thing with folks who think like you that goes something like this: "If a person doesn't want an involved 15 button full on DPSer rotation on a Healer...it obviously means they don't care about optimizing, doing well in the Job, must not do Savage, and clearly only press 1 button now and will press 1 button only in the future, so them doing low damage and getting kicked from groups won't change their game experience at all (somehow)"

It's an inane "counter".

Especially to someone like me, who is genuinely advocating FOR SOMETHING YOU WANT, just with you 75% of the way instead of 100%. Do you always attack and belittle people trying to help you?

I engage with the full rotations on the three healers I play on, thank you very much. And I actually do Savage (now) and have done Extremes for three expansions. Good god, no wonder you don't get what you want with that attitude. I'm literally saying "we have 4 Healers, the Devs could increase the dps kits on 2-3 of them and mix things up without it harming the game", and your response was to attack me instead? Really dude?

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EDIT:

While I'm no fan of homogenization in general, and Twelve know healers are the ones that need it the least, I think it'd make sense if Toxicon becomes Sage's version of Misery - get adderstings as a reward for shielding, get 3 stacks and you get a big boom spell.

One problem with this is it would likely be too powerful. Keep in mind Misery can't be generated by spamable heals (e.g. Cure 2s), only from spending a GCD consuming a resource you only get one of every 20 seconds. If SGE could just cast 3x Eukrasia Diagnosis and then get a DPS neutral/gain nuke, that would be pretty unbalanced.

Sacred Soil stepped on asylums toes first with getting a regen on it
It's too late for Asylum to step on Sacred's toes if Sacred is stomping all over it already

Honestly, I'd be fine with it coming with Confession/Plenary Indulgence. A 10 sec Protect/Shell would give me a reason to actually hit PI, and Expedience and Fey Illumination are precedent for "two in one" abilities like that. It has a 60 sec CD already and is rarely used because it's seldom needed. Normally using PI means one or MAYBE two AOE heals, probably Rapture, and you really don't use the full 10 sec duration and effect because you simply don't need to heal people for more than 100% health that often. Having a mitigation tacked on would actually make it more useful for its intended purpose, which is large incoming damage in several waves. The mitigation could be used to reduce it while the boosted healing would be used for restoring that damage. And when a fight doesn't require that, it would serve just fine as an additional party mitigation for when Temperance is on CD or when a smaller mitigation would do, and give WHM 3 total mitigations per 3 minute time period.

Glad to see I'm not the only one who doesn't find Dots engaging. I Liked Aero 3s animation but that was it.

Glad to see I'm not alone either! People have this weird idea that DoTs are somehow the pentacle of amazing game design when, in practice, they're "thing you press once every 30 seconds" boring and obnoxious. I wouldn't even mind them if it wasn't for the fact EVERY SINGLE HEALER has one as part of its carbon-copy "damage rotation". I've even said many times, I can actually like DoTs IF the class using them is built around using them and they have interactions. For example, a DoT that stacks to 3 and all three refresh when you refresh it, but if you let it fall off, you have to stack to 3 again (I haven't played it in years, but I remember Druids in WoW having a HoT that worked this way that you'd maintain on the main tank), or things like Bane and Fester (the old ones) that interacted with DoTs. The ones in FFXIV simply do not. WHM has never had any kit interaction with DoTs and they have always been "apply, don't let fall off...and that's it" for the Job.

Though I, too, miss twirly staff tornado storm Aero 3.

I will counter one thing, though: SCH's Miasma 2 was kind of nice for some fights like Brayflox Hard's final boss since the initial tick of damage counted for knocking bombs away in all those old fights where you had to do that. They just needed to make it where it was a DPS loss on single target but a DPS gain for AOE (like Art of War is) to allow spamming it for AOE situations but not force people to use an AOE ability for single target fights. Aero 3 should have been the same. They managed to do this with the regular single target vs AOE nuke spells, so they should be able to manage it for AOE DoTs in some way, too. Or just make them 1-2 AOE combos somehow.

I also agree with buffing. I never understand HEALERS that want to DAMAGE. Healing is a support role. The point is to aid and boost allies, and that's the player most attracted to the role. I don't even mind having damage focused healers AS ONE OF THE OPTIONS, but having them all be that is just silly. Other MMOs managed to figure this out, I'm not sure why FFXIV - and not even FFXIV, more FFXIV's hardcore/elitist players - can't.

SCH isn’t a pretty job, it’s a tactician/field medic

What part of "field medic" screams "I poison people to death", though?

This trend towards “fey mage” has no basis in SCH’s lore and makes it feel too much like a WHM

WHM's have no connection to Fey Magic, so it doesn't make SCH feel like WHM's at all. And it's not some new trend with no basis. SCH's ENTIRE lore is based on them working with their partner/pet. That IS their lore. The tactician part of their lore is expressed through it. SCH's being able to place Eos into the center of the arena or send her to the opposite side if the raid team has to split completely apart, being able to have her use abilities while the SCH is free to either deal damage or use their own heals, etc, is the tactician part of SCH. Issuing commands to their subordinate and leveraging both your character and your support minion to heal your party. I'm not sure what part about that DOESN'T feel like a tactician to you.

And that has been their lore from the start. It's not some new thing they've picked up. Whispering Dawn and Fey Illumination have been in the game since ARR.

The idea of DOT’s on healers is you can’t have rigid rotations on classes that may have to triage at any moment

This was a valid complaint in 2013, it isn't in 2022. If you weren't aware, the Devs have updated most Jobs to where combos don't break. On GNB, hit 1-2 then hit Gnashing Fang and watch something magical happen: You can go through your entire Gnashing Fang combo and that 3 button is still lit up and ready to go. PLD spells don't break their combos anymore, either. And I think RDM may not. Hop on MCH. Hit 1 then Drill then 2 then Chainsaw then 3. MAGIC!!!

Something amazing happened on the way to 2022: The Devs learned how to make it where combos don't break!

So a healer could have a "rigid combo" of 1-2-3 and be coded to where their healing spells don't break the combo. BAM! Problem solved!

DoTs on every healer are a relic from 2013/2.0 when healers only had one or two damage buttons to press. When WHM only had Stone 1 and Stone 2, which was better than Stone 1 in every way, and no oGCD heals to speak of, it made sense for them to have two DoTs since they might not have anything to do otherwise. That makes much less sense now with fights that have a lot more movement and higher APMs with oGCD weaves and instant cast movement heals and the like, as well as even WHM having more damage buttons now than they did in ARR.