The sad state of Coils of Bahamut.

[FireMage]

Yes, it is ran more than other past high-end trials. Because that’s the only way to access the story. Please stop comparing it to other raids.

Irrelevant to my point. Strawman elsewhere, this isn't Oz, we have no need of scarecrow guides

[flowerfairy]

I hope that you aren't confusing 'trivialized by ilevel' for 'inherently uninteresting'.

Only with Moggle Mog and Garuda did I mention item level cheese, but those trials are still fundamentally uninteresting no matter the item level. Sure, it might take longer to kill the boss and some attacks might hurt more, but the boss is still standing there auto attacking and doing nothing for a minute. There is sparse pressure on anyone except for the tanks who have to deal with cleaves. The only difference between that and what we see now is that the boss doesn’t teleport to the center.

There was a reason why the bosses did hardly anything: there was a lot more to manage on your job. Healers and tanks would have to flick through stances to deal with any kind of damage that’s taken, DPS had to press a couple buttons to make sure their aggro was low, etc. I think that’s what you might miss the most, because I don’t see how you can call these fights interesting. However, this goes back to one of my earlier points now: Whether SE decides to continue making jobs like they are now or shift gears back to past iterations has nothing to do with updating Coils. ARR content should still serve as a baseline for future expansions.

Makes perfect sense when you treat Copperbell and the other revamped MSQ dungeons as evidence in conjecturing what CBU3's modern fight design strategy will look like scaled down to ARR levels. Dodge pattern AoE, heal up raidwide, dodge different pattern AoE, mitigate tankbuster, monger for DPS uptime. They're all like that.

CBU3 has only adjusted mandatory content as of now. It’s easy because they don’t want to gatekeep the story behind mechanics that Sylphies and ice mages can’t clear. Old Copperbell was not interesting. Old Praetorium was not interesting. The only difference between new renovations and the old version was that it’s the kind of easy that fittingly builds up to what’s considered hard in the endgame. Yeah, the damage is lacking in those fights, but it goes back to the item level discussion, doesn’t it? Isn’t it a fine renovation if they did hurt a little more?

Eden and Pandemonium are still hard fights for the average person. Is it really taboo that I hold faith they can still make hard content?

ARR doesn't lack for 8-man content at all, it has twice as many trials as later expansions, and 'normal raids' are just trials by another name.

Sure, but then I say that those trials need adjusting as well. The reason I suggested Coils was because it’s a fine place to introduce complex mechanics. Raids are harder than trials because it’s not mandatory to clear to progress the MSQ.

[flowerfairy]

You're gonna wait a long time either way, the T12 pre-fight cutscene is like five minutes. Imagine getting that in raids roulette for 5 days in a row.

Obviously the cutscenes and the short dialogue with Alisaie in the turns will need adjusting. That particular cutscene can play before you actually jump into the heart and start the trial.

Edit: Mistook that for T13. For T12, the cutscene can still play before the trial starts. It'll be kinda awkward just looking at Grandpa bird waiting for the queue to pop, but the same thing happens in Nidhogg.

Irrelevant to my point. Strawman elsewhere, this isn't Oz, we have no need of scarecrow guides

Then please reiterate your point, because you've done nothing but that.

[Iscah]

I know this is an unpopular position because G'raha is everyone's favorite catboyfriend from everyone's favorite expansion, but if Estinien's backstory from the DRG job quests wasn't required for Heavensward and Nero's backstory from the Crystal Tower wasn't required for Stormblood, then G'raha's shouldn't have been required for Shadowbringers. There are ways to write that same plotline while leaving optional raids optional and not shoehorning more mandatory exposition during a part of the game that's already one of the most boring slogs.

The difference lies in whether the character's state is essentially the same at the end of the optional story as it was at the beginning. Estinien and Nero are not distinguishably different in personality or status from the start versus the end of their optional storylines. (I do wish they'd tidy up the post-questline dialogue from Alberic though, because it doesn't really line up with Estinien's re-entry to the MSQ.)

Additionally, if you pay attention to exactly how Nero introduces himself when he barges into the meeting at level 60, it's entirely between him and the city leaders who don't know him, so it plays out the same way regardless of whether you met him at the Crystal Tower or not.

By contrast, of course, G'raha's situation is completely changed from the beginning to the end of the CT storyline. Therefore for the MSQ to pick up the next chapter of his life after the events of CT, those events need to play out first.

For a while they did write events in Shadowbringers to make it work whether you'd played CT or not, with the time loop making it that it theoretically didn't matter whether you and present-day G'raha had been there yet, so long as it was going to happen in the near future and therefore the Exarch's past.

The CT story wasn't made mandatory until 5.3 when they wanted to continue present-day G'raha's story, which needs to build onwards from him being sealed in the tower at the end of CT. It also means you've definitely had that past relationship with him and the story can freely reference it without having to add alternate remarks all the time.

Making CT mandatory also freed up some other things. It resolves that earlier ambiguity of whether you knew Nero as an ally before he turns up in the MSQ at 60. It allowed the Eden story to have you draw on your memories of the Cloud of Darkness, because they could be certain that everyone had done it by then. It still could mean a belated reappearance by Unei and Doga in the Thirteenth.

As for the timing of requiring it at level 50 rather than later, that simply is where the story is set. Nero is fresh from his defeat at the Praetorium and Cid is in his ARR outfit. Also, the player is told to do the questline in 2.1, long before it becomes a roadblock.

"Unsync it" is a valid response to "I don't want to wait for PF to see this old sidestory", but also, synced Coils is already several times more active than Alex/Omega Savage, its closest analogues.

That's going to be a matter of accessibility at least as much as popularity. It's in the first layer of challenging content available to players, including those on the free trial. Alexander is a long way in, and Omega isn't included in the trial content.

[Arohk]

You're gonna wait a long time either way, the T12 pre-fight cutscene is like five minutes. Imagine getting that in raids roulette for 5 days in a row.

youre looking for problems that can be fixed so easily, simply put the cutscene before you enter the raid, like any other trial later in the game, you don't watch the whole emet selch cutscene every time you do hades or what ever...


instead of :

Enter the raid > watch cutscene > fight
change to :

Watch cutscene > queue for the raid > see how the boss spawns(skip) > fight

[FireMage]

Then please reiterate your point, because you've done nothing but that.

Not my responsibility to make you actually have reading comprehension. You quoted it so you should know

[flowerfairy]

Not my responsibility to make you actually have reading comprehension. You quoted it so you should know

Thanks for letting us know you have nothing to contribute to the topic, but next time I recommend that you only read the thread instead of throwing around low effort bait

[FireMage]

Thanks for letting us know you have nothing to contribute to the topic, but next time I recommend that you only read the thread instead of throwing around low effort bait

I did contribute. Go back and read. Dismissed