RDM underperforming by the way of neglect

[SaberMaxwell]

What's true is that the only thing that should matter in what a job's maximum DPS capability is is how much support it brings. You don't make the rules, you said it your self. Your "truth" is wrong.

Yes, RDM sucks right now and needs massive DPS buffs. It should be above BRD and DNC, but below the rest which sadly is not the case currently, as they are below even DNC.

If you don't like it, leave feedback on why you need to lose some support for more DPS or play a different job. If the truth bothers you in any way, you are the one who needs to change. :^)

We should lose verraise :^) It's worthless flavor and not worth dragging the job down as hard as it is.

[FireMage]

What's true is that the only thing that should matter in what a job's maximum DPS capability is is how much support it brings. You don't make the rules, you said it your self. Your "truth" is wrong.

Yes, RDM sucks right now and needs massive DPS buffs. It should be above BRD and DNC, but below the rest which sadly is not the case currently, as they are below even DNC.

RDM offers no real support besides Barrier. So not really an excuse. And no, there is no such thing as my truth, just THE truth which I'm telling you. Here's more facts for you, SAM/BLM > MNK/DRG/NIN > RPR/RDM > BRD/DNC > MCH/SMN is what proper balance would look like

[Mithron]

RDM offers no real support besides Barrier. So not really an excuse. And no, there is no such thing as my truth, just THE truth which I'm telling you. Here's more facts for you, SAM/BLM > MNK/DRG/NIN > RPR/RDM > BRD/DNC > MCH/SMN is what proper balance would look like

RDM also offers Vercure, Verraise and Embolden. Sure, Vercure and Verraise aren't necessarily "usable" without DPS loss, but that's the point and flavor of the job. You're meant to damage and have some healing, with backup raises. I don't think they should lose that much damage for Verraise, and I think Embolden should be buffed for them being the 3rd worst DPS, but they should remain at third worst DPS. Sadly, they are currently the worst DPS in this patch for almost every fight, but that's not what they should currently be.

In terms of what each job brings for support, this is the true, correct order of what should be top DPS to least:

BLM > SAM > MCH > RPR > MNK > SMN > DRG > NIN > RDM > BRD > DNC > DRK > GNB > WAR > PLD > SGE > WHM > SCH > AST

The cool thing about the truth is that it's true regardless of what YOU believe. You're just believing in a fantasy, not the truth. This list however, is objective and factual truth with no counter arguments, not even for MCH who offer no support and must have the DPS to reflect that regardless of their mobility or uptime.

The arguments you want to make are not what that list should be like CURRENTLY, but how the jobs should have support added/removed to then change their position. You want RDM to have less support in favor of more DPS. I think they should have slightly more support than they have now while also having more DPS. I think they should keep Verraise but never go above any other DPS than BRD or MCH, while perhaps getting even more support. RDM should be one of the most heavy support mage jobs, and should be seen as the "BRD/DNC" of the mage role. I don't think their Verraise should tax their DPS as much as having additional and better support options should.

[RylaBee]

I just wanted to discuss RDM need for some attention

Why is this person happening to my thread?

And no, there is no such thing as my truth, just THE truth which I'm telling you.

.. oh God. there is TWO of them

this is the true, correct order of what should be top DPS to least:
...
The cool thing about the truth is that it's true regardless of what YOU believe. You're just believing in a fantasy, not the truth. This list however, is objective and factual truth with no counter arguments

[SaberMaxwell]

If we're talking rDPS, which we should be for damage rankings, Embolden is already counted into RDM's ranking.

[SaberMaxwell]

I just wanted to discuss RDM need for some attention

Why is this person happening to my thread?


.. oh God. there is TWO of them

Job balance always brings out people's passion, both for the love of the game and love of their jog. Since balance is a topic that affects everyone even if they're not buffed, its natural for even people not maining or playing a job to have opinions. Red Mage in particular gets a lot of for many reasons, from people who want a dps to be a dps to people who want to play a healer without playing a healer.

Sure you'll have some bad faith actors but I choose to believe none are here...yet.

[SaberMaxwell]

On phone so can't correct but I meant "job" not "jog."

[FireMage]

RDM also offers Vercure, Verraise and Embolden. Sure, Vercure and Verraise aren't necessarily "usable" without DPS loss, but that's the point and flavor of the job. You\\'re meant to damage and have some healing, with backup raises. I don't think they should lose that much damage for Verraise, and I think Embolden should be buffed for them being the 3rd worst DPS, but they should remain at third worst DPS. Sadly, they are currently the worst DPS in this patch for almost every fight, but that's not what they should currently be.

So much of this is a swing and a miss. Vercure and Verraise are not actual taxes, neither of them are used in an optimal setting besides Vercure during downtime to prep Doublecast. You do not tax things on a "What if" basis. Oh and Embolden is part of their damage. You are aware that rDPS contributions are the DPS of who is contributing said buff, yes? They aren't proper utility. The only thing RDM has that is proper utility is Barrier

Your SUBJECTIVE ranking (because it's not true) ignores difficulty and proper taxes. BLM is the most difficult Job in the game to optimize, and requires planning out the entire fight to perform well, positioning and movement and what to save and what to spend, it's all things that elevate a class towards the high end in proper balance, and it only has two taxes, the ability to not need to be on the boss and a relatively easy on paper rotation. SAM gets its position only if Kaiten came back, otherwise it gets shoved with all the non RPR melee in the 2nd grouping

Melee have the hardest rotations with the exception of RPR, and also must be on the boss, and offer no actual utility (again exception of RPR) hence why they belong basically clustered together. RPR get shoved down the rest of the melee due to its ease and utility, and being neck and neck (again if actual balance was a thing) with RDM

RDM has only Barrier for utility, has the ability to be off the boss most of the time, however those taxes start being countered with the worst movement of the casters and RNG ridiculousness like what BRD and DNC have to put up with, requiring in the moment decision making

As for the official phys ranged and their honorary member SMN, well easiest rotations and ease of movement/uptime. BRD/DNC get to be higher due to being a bit harder and having more place for optimization. It doesn't matter that MCH is selfish, it has a ridiculously easy rotation

That's proper balance, and I was able to educate you as to why. You're welcome. Now that's not to say that gaps should be massive either. If BLM were a 100, then the next grouping (most melee) should be a 96, then (RDM/RPR) 92, (BRD/DNC) 88, and lastly (SMN/MCH) an 85

As of now proper balance is not being implemented, and RDM despite being gameplay wise functional is not performing as it should. These are facts

[Mithron]

RDM's Embolden gives DPS to other players, therefore it's support and RDM must do lower DPS than other jobs because of it for balance. There is nothing you can say/think/believe/do to change this fact.

Job difficulty should never matter in terms of DPS and game balance. All that should matter in DPS and game balance is how much support and DPS buffing the job adds to others. If MCH offers no DPS buffing and minimal support but still does less damage than a another who offers amazing DPS buffing, why would you ever pick MCH over another? I do want more difficulty and complexity in some jobs' rotations, but that should never, ever, ever be a factor in game balance and how much damage a job can do. The moment it does is the moment jobs become ostracized and unplayable because why play the EZ mode SAM selfish DPS when you can play RDM who offers both Embolden and higher DPS despite being more difficult to play? That's not game balance. That's wrong.

You do tax things on a "what if" basis, by the way. 100%, for sure, with certainty you do. The amount of wipes you can save with Verraise in standard pug PF groups is most definitely worth lowering RDM's DPS for, and is RDM's defining feature.

[Azuri]

RDM's Embolden gives DPS to other players, therefore it's support and RDM must do lower DPS than other jobs because of it for balance. There is nothing you can say/think/believe/do to change this fact.

Job difficulty should never matter in terms of DPS and game balance. All that should matter in DPS and game balance is how much support and DPS buffing the job adds to others. If MCH offers no DPS buffing and minimal support but still does less damage than a another who offers amazing DPS buffing, why would you ever pick MCH over another? I do want more difficulty and complexity in some jobs' rotations, but that should never, ever, ever be a factor in game balance and how much damage a job can do. The moment it does is the moment jobs become ostracized and unplayable because why play the EZ mode SAM selfish DPS when you can play RDM who offers both Embolden and higher DPS despite being more difficult to play? That's not game balance. That's wrong.

You do tax things on a "what if" basis, by the way. 100%, for sure, with certainty you do. The amount of wipes you can save with Verraise in standard pug PF groups is most definitely worth lowering RDM's DPS for, and is RDM's defining feature.

Imagine trying to talk about rDPS with this.

You can see SMN players from a mile away.