Live Letter Thoughts

[Lauront]

It does. They just lost and the story has us on the other side. The story also acknowledges their side and characters understand why they are trying to do this. That doesn't mean we were going to let them do it.

But it doesn't. It very strongly tried to justify Venat's decision through giving the impression of it both being necessary and the best conceivable outcome given the circumstances (with the writers even nudging somewhat in this direction in some of the interviews, e.g. posing the rhetorical question of whether Hermes was the first step for mankind), stylising the sundering (this is only depicted somewhat more directly in its brutal aftermath in the Nier mobile crossover), with precious little raised as an objection to it throughout the story. The notion of how this contradicts various ideals or previous positions of the Scions (or even Emet, who is conscripted in praising Venat) does not even enter the dialogue - at most there is a half-hearted apology from her, but not specifically to the ancients, but instead addressed to her sundered champions, and Y'shtola pretty briskly brushes it aside. Only later through the Q&A (which predicates her decision more heavily on her beliefs) and within the Omega quest (which introduces a re-consideration of the actions of Emet, Hermes and Venat, questioning all three, as well as walking back the notion that there is a singular 'correct' response to despair in the context of the Endsinger) is this watered down. If you are referring, on the other hand, to the struggles of the Ascians, note this isn't what I am referring to nor is it what sparked this whole little discussion in the first place; rather, it was a reference to an AU.

[TheMightyMollusk]

I do hate people, so sure, let's go for it.

[Lauront]

I do hate people, so sure, let's go for it.

Well I am sure with the right incentives Meteion could be convinced to get back into her old line of work.

[TheMightyMollusk]

Well I am sure with the right incentives Meteion could be convinced to get back into her old line of work.

Could we teach her some new songs first? Maybe some death metal, really get us in the apocalyptic mood?

Just don't let the internet pick, or we'll all be Rick Rolled into oblivion.

[Bobby66]

How is it every time they are mentioned this becomes a debate about genocide.

[Anura]

Hey, I'm not applauding the countless fake deaths the game constantly throw at us and I WOULD like a darker story. BUT messing with timelines just so people can feel better would be ridiculous. Actions have consequences and that would just remove the bad and sad things to introduce a forced "happy ending." We should ask for more consequences for everyone, including us, not begging for another time travel garbage because some people can't let go.

[Lauront]

The "end it with the time travel garbage" ship sailed with EW, which plastered the mother of all time loops over its entire plot so centrally that significant elements of the setting's lore are now directly the result of a causal loop, with arguably detrimental effects on aspects of the world-building flowing from this (i.e. alternative, potentially more interesting explanations for these plot elements were discarded.) An AU is rather trivial by comparison and rather than undoing any 'consequences' in the current timeline would simply provide an opportunity to see how the ancients could handle matters given better circumstances - it need not even involve keeping faves like Emet around as you could pitch it after his demise (although SE seem hellbent on milking his popularity through cameos in flashbacks, so six of one, half a dozen of the other...) Again, while I think it'd be cool, it's not necessary to me so much as a firmer acknowledgement that things may well have turned out better for them had they been given the full story, rather than this being left as an hypothetical to be dangled about in interminable discussions relating to them. However, the objection to it that it will somehow introduce a forced happy ending at this point to me seems rather moot. With so many stars destroyed, it is but one other way of introducing a future expansion destination to the story.

Regarding people "letting go", you cannot fault them for enjoying the ancients when it was the very intention of the writers to build sympathy for the Ascians by showing the people that they lost - and this civilisation appealed to many far more than the ones we've seen put on screen so far. Some of us are somewhat less interested in the future of the game in their absence, and particularly if it doubles down on the (rather hypocritical) storytelling approach it took with them...

[Anura]

Maybe they could write a story about it, then? Like those stories they write every (?) expansion. They could make a little series of it and try not to contradict what goes inside the game. Because, honestly, as much as I like Venat, I'd rather forget about time travel and AU, and I'd like the devs to forget about it too. Alexander was cool, I'm not a fan of the crystal tower and I absolutely hate what we received with EW. I don't want to see what they come up with next in regards to all this.

[Hurlstone]

I do find the genocide aspect of the debate... just... bonkers. I really never expected a situation here where simply liking a character leads to accusations of supporting mass murder. Where people acting the same when Emet-Selch first popped up? You know, founder of the multiple imperial-inclined nations that had genocidal themes and kept trying to ignight his own form of mass murder...

In a way, Hydaelyn and her part in the story felt like an adaption of the question “Why does God allow for suffering?” and I thought they did well showing her actions as a ‘necessary evil’ but thats just me. Would it have been nice for perhaps some of the Scions to perhaps disagree with her? Like Thancred, who lost Minfilia due to her unwavering faith in Hydaleyn? Sure, but who ever said the story was perfect?

But I feel once again this is off-topic... please feel free to ignore/jump on my words as if they are Target dummies and you a Dragoon eadger to test their new oGCDs. Whatever makes people happy. Now back on topic... Umm... I am looking foward to the new Reaper lady we will meet in 6.2! Hope she joins us in Trusts and stuff. Will be nice to have another female NPC who takes to the frontlines now that Lyse and (for now) Alisaie are absent from our crew. The 'female characters should be support' is a JRPG trope we should see less of, but one that FFXIV has mostly avoided thanks to them and others.

[Atelier-Bagur]

I do find the genocide aspect of the debate... just... bonkers. I really never expected a situation here where simply liking a character leads to accusations of supporting mass murder. Where people acting the same when Emet-Selch first popped up? You know, founder of the multiple imperial-inclined nations that had genocidal themes and kept trying to ignight his own form of mass murder...

In a way, Hydaelyn and her part in the story felt like an adaption of the question “Why does God allow for suffering?” and I thought they did well showing her actions as a ‘necessary evil’ but thats just me. Would it have been nice for perhaps some of the Scions to perhaps disagree with her? Like Thancred, who lost Minfilia due to her unwavering faith in Hydaleyn? Sure, but who ever said the story was perfect?

But I feel once again this is off-topic... please feel free to ignore/jump on my words as if they are Target dummies and you a Dragoon eadger to test their new oGCDs. Whatever makes people happy. Now back on topic... Umm... I am looking foward to the new Reaper lady we will meet in 6.2! Hope she joins us in Trusts and stuff. Will be nice to have another female NPC who takes to the frontlines now that Lyse and (for now) Alisaie are absent from our crew. The 'female characters should be support' is a JRPG trope we should see less of, but one that FFXIV has mostly avoided thanks to them and others.

To me it almost always feels like people trying to paint things in black and white, because they cant understand grey. Even though they say they love when characters and stories have grey moralities anyway and do a bunch of mental gymnastics over why Venat is the worst piece of scum ever, unlike our lord and saviors Emet-Selch, Lahabrea, Elidibus etc etc etc. I feel like there was at least some optional dialogue with the Scions where they did talk about Hyadaelyn's actions and how they ultimately felt about it but I could be wrong, but I somehow recall reading that.

Anyway back to 6.2 stuff, yeah I'm very excited for mystery reaper lady, and there's a good chance that she winds up being the elusive 1.0 fem-Meteor design people have been wanting finally being a canon character (due to how similar her face and hair looks from the short glimpses we see in the trailer).