Live Letter Thoughts

[aveyond-dreams]

and yet it feels like you're trying to find solutions to issues you deem need to be "fixed" when they really dont. Maturity? This game already has plenty of that. Characters and settings that are fleshed out? Yup that as well.

Honestly the best thing the devs should do is to continue providing more with what we already have. My standards for this game is to see it continue to improve the basic foundations it laid with its story and gameplay. Not shift directions when there really isnt a need to make this game into something that isnt FFXIV. It always sounds like you want this game to be another game entirely and this is where I clash with your viewpoints. Those arent "standards" those are full on opinions.

I expect for characters to evolve in meaningful ways by way of growth, loss, change, or death. The scions did not provide this to a sufficient degree in Endwalker, and in some cases showed regression rather than progression. To then have these characters tell everyone else to forge ahead based off trauma that they either suffered so long ago or show no lasting impact from did not have the intended impact they thought they were going for.

The maturity of Endwalker was tainted irreparably by the extended focus on slice of life and humour. There is a time and place for such things, the expansion about an apocalypse wasn't the best place for them, certainly not to this degree. It feels that FFXIV shifted from a high fantasy game in Shadowbringers to one that struggles with its identity in Endwalker. This wasn't in the best interest of those of us who wanted to see the themes and setting of the game done justice. Hence why some of us take issues with the Loporrits dancing atop Zodiark's resting place, a coffee shop being opened in Ultima Thule, and the infamous burger scene.

I want FFXIV to be FFXIV. A high quality fantasy game with excellent storytelling. I believe this was accomplished in Heavensward and Shadowbringers. I would like to see it meet or exceed the standards of those two expansions at the bare minimum moving forward.

[VelKallor]

Hence why some of us take issues with the Loporrits dancing atop Zodiark's resting place

Drat those people having FUN and celebrating life. The NERVE...

a coffee shop being opened in Ultima Thule

....you skip cutscenes, dont you?

, and the infamous burger scene.

[Seera1024]

and yet it feels like you're trying to find solutions to issues you deem need to be "fixed" when they really dont. Maturity? This game already has plenty of that. Characters and settings that are fleshed out? Yup that as well.

Honestly the best thing the devs should do is to continue providing more with what we already have. My standards for this game is to see it continue to improve the basic foundations it laid with its story and gameplay. Not shift directions when there really isnt a need to make this game into something that isnt FFXIV. It always sounds like you want this game to be another game entirely and this is where I clash with your viewpoints. Those arent "standards" those are full on opinions.

He's allowed to have the opinion that it needs to be fixed and therefore present solutions to that problem.

And this is coming from someone who doesn't share his view point. I feel like the direction the game is going story wise is just fine.

On the topic of this thread: This is going to be one packed patch and hopefully, everything goes smoothly with the patch release.

[Atelier-Bagur]

I expect for characters to evolve in meaningful ways by way of growth, loss, change, or death. The scions did not provide this to a sufficient degree in Endwalker, and in some cases showed regression rather than progression. To then have these characters tell everyone else to forge ahead based off trauma that they either suffered so long ago or show no lasting impact did not have the intended impact they thought they were going for.

The maturity of Endwalker was tainted irreparably by the extended focus on slice of life and humour. There is a time and place for such things, the expansion about an apocalypse wasn't the best place for them, certainly not to this degree. It feels that FFXIV shifted from a high fantasy game in Shadowbringers to one that struggles with its identity in Endwalker. This wasn't in the best interest of those of us who wanted to see the themes and setting of the game done justice. Hence why some of us take issues with the Loporrits dancing atop Zodiark's resting place.

I want FFXIV to be FFXIV. A high quality fantasy game with excellent storytelling. I believe this was accomplished in Heavensward and Shadowbringers. I would like to see it meet or exceed the standards of those two expansions at the bare minimum moving forward.

Yet I disagree that you and others believe that EW had issues with how they wrote the Scions in the narrative. Personally I feel like HW and ShB alone are overrated and that the only reason they held any value to it's narrative and presentation is due to the backbone of the established setting in prior expansions before it.

If we took Heavensward as a standalone game then it wouldn't have worked, and the same goes for Shadowbringers and yeah this also means Endwalker. FFXIV' story is the sum of all it's parts and me personally I still see that it's quality being consistent.

But I'm not going to continue to argue over the story of the entire game. We already have such a thread for it.

[VelKallor]

I would have found more satisfaction

Is a better way of putting it.

fans of the scions are getting tired of them themselves

One reddit thread amongst a playerbase of millions is representative of NOTHING.

It is possible FFXIV may have a similar scenario occurring, wherein certain players are unwilling to entertain discussions about things like new characters especially when even the fans of the scions are getting tired of them themselves, and other relevant issues pertaining to story, content, and gameplay.

Not as much as as your continued absurd claims that you speak for others when this is your opinion and yours alone.

Comments like this sweeping claim with NO PROOF to back it up:

which is what a significant number of players feel isn't happening at the moment.

dont help your case...unless , of course, you can actually demonstrate who this significant number of players is.......you cant..can you?

Because they dont exist.

[aveyond-dreams]

You arn't looking for a compromise, you are looking to get a specific style of writing, what YOU want. I honestly dont care how the author chooses to write, and Im not going to sit here and tell them how they should write, and bring up other works and tell them they should be like so-so. This isn't a resistance to outside suggestions, this is me saying the Authors vision should be delivered THEIR way, not somebody elses way.

I suppose that is the difference between you and I then. I am not going to hold myself back from weighing in on their work and bringing my perspective to the table. I feel that this is a necessary element in gauging people's reception to the story. Analyse both what people liked, and what they didn't. Whether they choose to act on people's feedback is their choice to make.

Its just like how there was a time, and sometimes still is people form WoW that like to come into FFXIV and say it needs to be like Wow. Saying FFXIV needs to have the same systems to be successful. Lo and behold, FFXIV isn't using those systems, and is still very successful without it. Meanwhile WoW has to steal from others to be successful.

I believe that FFXIV would benefit from incorporating some of WoW's systems, such as its Transmog system of glamours, as well as the customizable mounts and Dragon Riding that is coming are Dragonflight. Regardless of the source of the features, I believe these are some good ones that will help improve the FFXIV player experience.

Sure, not everybody will be happy. But I trust their decisions on the games direction more then somebody who will spend so much energy complaining about a character eating a Hamburger, or think every instance of fun and joy is bad.

I will continue to cite that scene as an example of one of the ways in which Endwalker missed the mark in terms of the tone in its storytelling. No one to date has provided an argument as to why scenes such as that one and Estinien's boot should have not only taken up so much of the animation budget, but were included while not depicting iconic moments such as the Sundering. Sharlayan and its characters were largely cleansed of elements that would have provided the sense of danger and intrigue once associated with them in the past, and I don't think this was to the game's benefit either.

This isn't a resistance to outside suggestions, this is me saying the Authors vision should be delivered THEIR way, not somebody elses way. This isnt Dragonage, or Game of thrones, or -insert title here-. If you want that, I believe you should go enjoy those titles, instead of trying to make and turn somebody elses work into another work.

In response to the above I will provide the following statements:

I suppose this might be another post to potentially bookmark in order to keep track of the points being raised but as has been pointed out in the past it is specifically being requested that there are meaningful lasting consequences for at least some of the major protagonists.

Not just throwaway side characters of little relevance who are created with the intention of dying horribly. Not only antagonists and villains who are predictably given a sob story to induce sympathy and then unceremoniously killed off.

The occasional character on the level of Alisae, Y'shtola, Urianger, Raubhan, Nanamo or Merlwyb actually facing death in a meaningful and well written fashion would do wonders to portray some actual stakes.

I'm not convinced that one sided magic and world altering abilities are particularly engaging, either. Wanting more fantasy elements does not necessarily equal wanting them to manifest solely as an excuse to shield the major characters at almost every turn, especially when the story is written in such a way as to disallow the antagonists to score any meaningful on screen victories.

I want a compelling story and lasting consequences would achieve that as far as I'm concerned.

As has been pointed out over the numerous past occasions where the 'this is not Game of Thrones' line has been spouted, many of us aren't asking for mass death for the sake of mass death and are instead asking for death to occur where and when it makes sense. Cladding the bulk of the cast in extensive plot armour simply sends things in the opposite direction.

I would humbly suggest bookmarking this post if you're able to. It might help refresh your memory next time this same point is raised.

[Zanarkand-Ronso]

I suppose that is the difference between you and I then. I am not going to hold myself back from weighing in on their work and bring my perspective to the table. I feel that this is a necessary element in gauging people's reception to the story. Analyze both what people liked, and what they didn't. Whether they choose to act on people's feedback is their choice to make.

No, you shouldn't hold back and should bring your perspective. The issue again, is trying to turn the Authors work, into somebody elses work.
Suggesting a more mature theme, saying you'd like to see new characters...not an issue...saying something akin to: X game does things this way and I like it so FFXIV needs to be this way or it wont succeed, is an issue. Thats not constructive. Its your personal opinion, but its not really aimed at improving the game, more-so just trying to turn it into something else.
Basically, you want a different game, but you still want to call it FFXIV.

Ill also add this. Sure, WoWs Transmog system would be neat. But I was referring to things like the Borrowed Power systems, or the many things that are deemed "Time-wasters"
People want to put that crap into FFXIV, even after it being a contributing factor to why WoW isn't fun.
The Glamour log being improved. Heck we all want that. But these time wasting systems nobody wants.

[aveyond-dreams]

Its your personal opinion, but its not really aimed at improving the game, more-so just trying to turn it into something else.
Basically, you want a different game, but you still want to call it FFXIV.

I fail to see how asking for FFXIV to adopt the Heavensward approach to storytelling again constitutes wanting a different game but still calling it FFXIV.

[Zanarkand-Ronso]

I fail to see how asking for FFXIV to adopt the Heavensward approach to storytelling again constitutes wanting a different game but still calling it FFXIV.

You've asked for more then a Heavensward Approach.

For example, you keep bringing up other games and how they do their storytelling. Thats not asking for a Heavenward approach.
Saying how we should constantly be setting up camps after a dungeon and eating food rations and hunting for food, is not asking for a Heavensward Approach.
Talking about Friction between people, Arguments. Tension between party members as seen on other games, is not asking for a Heavenward Approach

[redheadturk]

You've asked for more then a Heavensward Approach.

For example, you keep bringing up other games and how they do their storytelling. Thats not asking for a Heavenward approach.
Saying how we should constantly be setting up camps after a dungeon and eating food rations and hunting for food, is not asking for a Heavensward Approach.
Talking about Friction between people, Arguments. Tension between party members as seen on other games, is not asking for a Heavenward Approach

I too want more of a HW approach, darker story where death has meaning. I also want them to take the shb approach, unravel the time loop and allow both Ancient and Sundered to have their happy endings in a separate timeline. There was no reason they couldn't have gone with a branched timeline, which would have satisfied those of us who love the Ancients.