Ardbert's Party vs the Scions Analysis

[SannaR]

They could have done more with Scions this time and just... didn't. How about exploring Thancred's (and I suppose Urianger too) emotional turmoil about Ryne outside of a couple of grimaces? How about G'raha struggling with leaving the supposedly hopeless 8UC timeline to theoretically die only for the future he thought he saved potentially being worse (not to mention Lyna)? How about Ryne having more of a reaction to the impending death of their shard after thinking their world had been saved? How about Y'shtola showing any concern for Runar? (I don't recall her mentioning him once despite her life's mission supposedly being how to get back to him.) I could go on and on about deep, emotional themes and character development they could have delved into that were either ignored or glossed over a unbelievable amount.

So you'd what want to erase Thancred's growth? And what behave how he had been about Minfillia til we started the plan to go visit Nabaath Areng Y'shtola had been criticizing him about? What are Ryne or Lyna supposed to do other than pray for our success? It's not like they could do anything about it. Just because we don't see some things or that they aren't lit up with a bright neon sign doesn't mean they don't happen. Even if it's in the Tales from stories.

Not sure what JRPGs you've played but Chrono Trigger, Chrono Cross during the 1st play through, all of the numbered Final Fantasys, Star Ocean 2, Star Ocean til the end of time, Shining Force, Lufia, Secret of Mana and Dragon Quest tend to be more of the no choice or very limited for the protagonist. Not that I know if Iscah has played those.

[Silvarer]

Meanwhile, the Scions never die so there's no membership turnover either.

That’s just a blatantly false statement right there. Minfilia and Papalymo both died. Lyse left the Scions at the end of Stormblood. Krile, Alisaie, G’raha, and Estinien all joined the group after we did. G’raha and Estinien are also two people we met in our previous adventures before they were Scions, so your claim that we don’t get to keep any of the people we’ve met along the way isn’t entirely true either. There’s been plenty of change in the composition of it, but I guess you want to pretend that there hasn’t been just because some of the older members are still around.

[VelKallor]

I have every faith in the FF 14 writing team, I have loved the story , I look forward to more. I have been gaming since the late 80's, noting with absolute certainty that Ishikawa Natsuko ranks amongst the top 5 writers in gaming over the last forty years.

In that top 5 I include System Shock 2 ( the voice acting was second to NONE ), F.E.A.R. and Laura Bow.

[Thaciscokidd]

I have every faith in the FF 14 writing team, I have loved the story , I look forward to more. I have been gaming since the late 80's, noting with absolute certainty that Ishikawa Natsuko ranks amongst the top 5 writers in gaming over the last forty years.

I honestly want to see her do something else from the ground up weather it be a mainline numbered FF story, an off shoot, or another one all together. I'll give her props on Shadowbringers but you could argue that she is just building on something that Kazutoyo built.

I want to see her with creations all of her own.

[Lustre]

Uhmmmm ACTUALLY SWEETY here's why you're wrong

I kid. Good post. I'd like to see some of the minor scions fleshed out a bit more if we're continue having them around all the time. But ideally I'd rather have a new party entirely. I will say, I think that the scions were a lot more interesting in ARR/HW and then over time they gradually all became the same person. Character traits get buffed away (see thancred in EW) for the sake of a convenient and contrived plot. If they leaned into what made them different from each other a bit more maybe it wouldnt be so bad, but yeah, things are a bit bland at the moment. I thought estinien would be a breath of fresh air for the scions but then the estinien we got wasn't the estinien I originally liked in the first place. Dude went from legendary acclaimed dragoon with hella character depth to "hehe what is money" lol.

I suppose having a party of white haired smart people is kinda par for the course for a SE RPG but with so many different perspectives and cultures they have to lean on, it's odd they chose to keep them all sharlayan based. Imagine if we got a garlean like Jullus in the party, being torn internally between their days in the empire and nowadays, struggling to make sense of things and their place in the world outside of garlemald. That's a whole character arc right there lol ez. How about a big dumb highlander from ala mihgo who's well intentioned but always gets into fights and trouble. There are a lot of predictable media tropes they could lean into that have been done to death and it would still be more interesting than the current party of "never wrong, always right" characters we have now

[Lauront]

Uhmmmm ACTUALLY SWEETY here's why you're wrong

I kid. Good post. I'd like to see some of the minor scions fleshed out a bit more if we're continue having them around all the time. But ideally I'd rather have a new party entirely. I will say, I think that the scions were a lot more interesting in ARR/HW and then over time they gradually all became the same person. Character traits get buffed away (see thancred in EW) for the sake of a convenient and contrived plot. If they leaned into what made them different from each other a bit more maybe it wouldnt be so bad, but yeah, things are a bit bland at the moment. I thought estinien would be a breath of fresh air for the scions but then the estinien we got wasn't the estinien I originally liked in the first place. Dude went from legendary acclaimed dragoon with hella character depth to "hehe what is money" lol.

I suppose having a party of white haired smart people is kinda par for the course for a SE RPG but with so many different perspectives and cultures they have to lean on, it's odd they chose to keep them all sharlayan based. Imagine if we got a garlean like Jullus in the party, being torn internally between their days in the empire and nowadays, struggling to make sense of things and their place in the world outside of garlemald. That's a whole character arc right there lol ez. How about a big dumb highlander from ala mihgo who's well intentioned but always gets into fights and trouble. There are a lot of predictable media tropes they could lean into that have been done to death and it would still be more interesting than the current party of "never wrong, always right" characters we have now

Agreed. Even if they did not kill them off in EW in UT (or anywhere else where they had the opportunity), they did have them nominally disband. It's time to experiment with retiring them, even if partially, and introducing new cast members, with more pronounced differentiation in their viewpoints and mindsets, as well as backgrounds. The current group is stale and I for one am bored to death of them. I dread the notion of 10 more years of the current crew.

[VelKallor]

TV Tropes is an observation of how people tend to write stories, not an instruction manual.

Not to mention that I can count on the fingers of one hand the number of writers that can even approach Ishikawa Natsuko's gift.

Personally I am expecting 6.X to be something of an interim storyline and 7.0 to be a new recommended launching point for people who don't want to play all the way from the beginning but still want to get into the story.

Much the same as the post MSQ questlines for HW and Stormblood etc set the stage. My money says Meracydia.

Or...Yshtola finds a way to visit the other shards..now THAT would be interesting.

It's not yet clear how this will work on a large scale, and whether that will involve another multi-expansion plotline.

Actually, it would not surprise me if thats exactly what they plan to do.

[GrizzlyTank]

White hair gang > Dead peoples gang.

Checkmate Aveyond

[redheadturk]

White hair gang > Dead peoples gang.

Checkmate Aveyond

Eh, no. Dead People's Gang was infinitely better, IMHO. Whether that was the Ancients, or Ardbert's gang. What happened to the Ancients was a frickin' tragedy, they deserved better than getting merced by Venat, who should have told them what was going on despite the risks so they could solve the real issue. And Ardbert's party certainly deserved better than being manipulated into destroying their world.