Thread: Revert summoner to 5.55 while re-reworking it please?

hehehe press lego go boom very fun :thumbsup:

Originally Posted by Ayden

Although having more primals are nice, adding more primals like Shiva, Ramuh and Leviathan does not add any depth to the job, you will just be using rite, catastrophe and astral flow of different elements.

Honestly what job has any depth anymore? Astro and Dragoon are busy but where is the depth? Summoner is just like every other job in this game. Homogenize.

There's a way to had some depth in the current SMN.

- Shorten the cooldown of bahamut and phoenix so that you can just throw 2 gems summoning between them. This way we have to make choices
- Enhance the specificity of the gem summonings skills

Originally Posted by Yanyami

There's a way to had some depth in the current SMN.

- Shorten the cooldown of bahamut and phoenix so that you can just throw 2 gems summoning between them. This way we have to make choices
- Enhance the specificity of the gem summonings skills

I dont really agree because the smn will not be synchronized to the buff window of the party.
I would add another 2/3 elementals to actually give the smn a choice as to which one is best to use. Each elemental will bring advantages and disadvantages and it will be at the discretion of the smn which elemental to summon in order to best deal with the game mechanics
I would make phoenix's unique abilities (hot and heal) castable when the smn actually finds them useful.
I would add ogcds to make the burst phases even more hectic. Currently with 4 festers per burst you have to have a minimum of timing, adding more ogcds will increase the difficulty because it will force the smn to decide whether to make waivers, choose which ogcds to pull, and to always stay focused to cast them at the right time and not lose timing and uptime because of wrong weaving.

Originally Posted by fulminating

I’m not asking for a permanent rollback, just one while they decide which direction they want to take summoner. If goring blade, the magic and oGCDs were removed from paladin leaving only a simplified royal authority/atonement combo I’d be asking for the same. That this has been done to a DPS is beyond the pale.

Edit: your thing says machinist- imagine if all you had was barrel stabiliser tacked onto drill and the hypercharge buttons.

Any rollback temporary or permanent is not going to happen. MCH’s begged and pleaded for a rollback throughout Stormblood when the job was literally unplayable for 80% of the playerbase, it did not happen.

All I’m saying is stop looking backwards, take what you currently have and build and expand upon it. The direction of summoner is fine, but any one would agree it needs more. Aetherflow is not an interesting job mechanic, summoner needs something more. It needs something to keep people engaged but it has to be something worth while. Previous iterations of summoner are not going to hold the key to this answer.

What are some job mechanics you would like to see added to the current iteration that would make it better? Something that makes sense for the new direction and adds something beneficial to the summoner.

Originally Posted by Darkpaw

Any rollback temporary or permanent is not going to happen. MCH’s begged and pleaded for a rollback throughout Stormblood when the job was literally unplayable for 80% of the playerbase, it did not happen.

All I’m saying is stop looking backwards, take what you currently have and build and expand upon it. The direction of summoner is fine, but any one would agree it needs more. Aetherflow is not an interesting job mechanic, summoner needs something more. It needs something to keep people engaged but it has to be something worth while. Previous iterations of summoner are not going to hold the key to this answer.

What are some job mechanics you would like to see added to the current iteration that would make it better? Something that makes sense for the new direction and adds something beneficial to the summoner.

What part of SMN's direction is fine? Care to specify? All I see is a set in stone rotation of the ruin spam everyone apparently hated, with different colours every 15s. Please elucidate specifically what part of newSMN is a good direction to take the job, without diverging into fanciful imaginations about where it could go. I am sincerely curious about what an answer would be.

Originally Posted by Darkpaw

Any rollback temporary or permanent is not going to happen. MCH’s begged and pleaded for a rollback throughout Stormblood when the job was literally unplayable for 80% of the playerbase, it did not happen.

All I’m saying is stop looking backwards, take what you currently have and build and expand upon it. The direction of summoner is fine, but any one would agree it needs more. Aetherflow is not an interesting job mechanic, summoner needs something more. It needs something to keep people engaged but it has to be something worth while. Previous iterations of summoner are not going to hold the key to this answer.

What are some job mechanics you would like to see added to the current iteration that would make it better? Something that makes sense for the new direction and adds something beneficial to the summoner.

You can wax lyrical about where they might take it to your heart's content. Given how little DRK, MCH, WAR, WHM, AST, SCH and SCH(laser edition) have changed since their reworks, I refuse to hold my breath for the could-bes and blue moon thinking which we all know will amount to nothing. SMN doesn't even have a good base to build off now.

My complaints have also yet to touch on just what a mess it's made of the ACN>SMN/SCH fork, previously they had gameplay that had clearly branched in two directions with a good balance of similarities and differences. Now the nicest that can be said is they both spend their time spamming their ruin recolours.

Originally Posted by tearagion

What part of SMN's direction is fine? Care to specify? All I see is a set in stone rotation of the ruin spam everyone apparently hated, with different colours every 15s. Please elucidate specifically what part of newSMN is a good direction to take the job, without diverging into fanciful imaginations about where it could go. I am sincerely curious about what an answer would be.

At least it’s a summoner now not a badly implemented pet based DoT mage.

I find it funny how that people think I’m happy about summoner’s current implementation, when I’ve said repeatedly that the implementation was not well done.

You say it has no base, rotationally you may be correct, but in theme and identity it does have a solid start, the idea of using demi summons, and smaller summons that change the affect of job actions is a good idea on paper, however reskinning the same basic abilities is not a good implementation of that idea. They could work to build on that system and create something great.

My biggest point is that regression does not equal progression. Stop waxing fanciful about how great summoner was.. it wasn’t they’ve yet to hit a truly great implementation of summoner. Which is why they have altered summoner drastically every single expansion.

See the intent and the idea behind the implementation and build from that. Not looking back at previous iterations that have had people begging for summoner reworks all along. Or put forth an entirely new idea not based on anything currently existing or that which has come before.

Originally Posted by Darkpaw

At least it’s a summoner now not a badly implemented pet based DoT mage.

I find it funny how that people think I’m happy about summoner’s current implementation, when I’ve said repeatedly that the implementation was not well done.

You say it has no base, rotationally you may be correct, but in theme and identity it does have a solid start, the idea of using demi summons, and smaller summons that change the affect of job actions is a good idea on paper, however reskinning the same basic abilities is not a good implementation of that idea. They could work to build on that system and create something great.

My biggest point is that regression does not equal progression. Stop waxing fanciful about how great summoner was.. it wasn’t they’ve yet to hit a truly great implementation of summoner. Which is why they have altered summoner drastically every single expansion.

See the intent and the idea behind the implementation and build from that. Not looking back at previous iterations that have had people begging for summoner reworks all along. Or put forth an entirely new idea not based on anything currently existing or that which has come before.

Distilling all the other things I didn't ask about, and asked to exclude: the direction that is "fine" is the thematic direction, which hasn't significantly changed (still summoning simulacra of the same primals), other than SMN doesn't have DoTs anymore. Thanks for answering.

Many people feel the need to say that summoner is more "summoner now"

I do not know what makes people feel summoner being more summoner, but I would thought this is a video game not a tabletop RP DnD ripoff... I do enjoy me some roleplay from time to time, but if I want to play a video game I prefer enjoying the game content itself than the idea of me being able to summon big monsters. (Which by the way disappear after 2 seconds and the job is not actually summoner but borrower cause all you do is borrow their powers to your pet)

Alas, NO, I don't think reverting back is a good idea. Some things need fixing, and in the future patches or expansions we might get some extra actions. I just wish we could use all of our abilities with lowered potency in lower content. Doing dailies with low lvl summoner is a pain I try to avoid like the plague.