Interesting Question Regarding Voidsent.....

[SentioftheHoukai]

Up until now, basically all voidsent we've seen were evil so the angle that there are some who are still coherent enough to resent the state of their world and desiring salvation rather then endlessly trying to escape into the Source and shards simply to prey on their inhabitants or just generally make nuisances of themselves is new.

The Ascians have always had shades of there being more depth to their motives since ARR, but voidsent have not really had that sort of nuance applied to them at any point.

I'd argue they'd had a fair bit of nuance ever since we learned they were corrupted people. Who knows what dreams, ambitions, aspirations etc. they have under that cloud of Dark-aspected aether? Who are we to make suppositions as to who they were and what they desire before they became monsters by fighting for the salvation of their Star. Man, EW really has solidified the black-and-white morality hasn't it?

[Cleretic]

So, Voidsent are interesting in that they aren't completely mindless, but they are universally single-minded. They're from a place starved of any non-dark aether, and they have ALL, to an individual, been motivated by that base starvation. Some of them are exceptionally smart--Lilith, Diabolos, all the succubi, at least ostensibly the mindflayers--but they have all been seeking out and consuming aether.

Something also worth noting is that we have literally never once seen a voidsent that isn't actively malicious. And the list of voidsent we have met isn't exactly a short list. The only one that's uttered even a hint of positivity that wasn't blatantly deceitful about it is Obvious Golbez saying that they're seeking 'redemption' for their star. But... even that doesn't really say he's on the up-and-up, because 'redemption' has two meanings, and neither of them exactly imply much good.

He could be saying 'redemption' in the more moral or divine sense, the 'redemption from sin' angle that we get 'redemption arc' from... which, of course, implies an open acknowledgement that they did wrong and need to do better.

Or, he could be saying 'redemption' in the more transactional sense, of getting what they feel they're owed. In which case we're back to that base aetheric need; he wants the aether that he feels is owed to them.


In short... actually, you can't say 'who knows what dreams and aspirations they have', because every voidsent has been phenomenally consistent. We know exactly what they want from life, and it's 'our aether, which they see no issues with taking by force'; they're starving (or more correctly grossly nutritionally deficient) and want to eat. There's one guy that might be different going by one interpretation of a line, but the other interpretation puts him right in the same category as everyone else.

[SentioftheHoukai]

So, Voidsent are interesting in that they aren't completely mindless, but they are universally single-minded. They're from a place starved of any non-dark aether, and they have ALL, to an individual, been motivated by that base starvation. Some of them are exceptionally smart--Lilith, Diabolos, all the succubi, at least ostensibly the mindflayers--but they have all been seeking out and consuming aether.

Something also worth noting is that we have literally never once seen a voidsent that isn't actively malicious. And the list of voidsent we have met isn't exactly a short list. The only one that's uttered even a hint of positivity that wasn't blatantly deceitful about it is Obvious Golbez saying that they're seeking 'redemption' for their star. But... even that doesn't really say he's on the up-and-up, because 'redemption' has two meanings, and neither of them exactly imply much good.

He could be saying 'redemption' in the more moral or divine sense, the 'redemption from sin' angle that we get 'redemption arc' from... which, of course, implies an open acknowledgement that they did wrong and need to do better.

Or, he could be saying 'redemption' in the more transactional sense, of getting what they feel they're owed. In which case we're back to that base aetheric need; he wants the aether that he feels is owed to them.


In short... actually, you can't say 'who knows what dreams and aspirations they have', because every voidsent has been phenomenally consistent. We know exactly what they want from life, and it's 'our aether, which they see no issues with taking by force'; they're starving (or more correctly grossly nutritionally deficient) and want to eat. There's one guy that might be different going by one interpretation of a line, but the other interpretation puts him right in the same category as everyone else.

My point was, that Voidsent aren't MONSTERS Clerectic. Just like Sin Eaters, just like Blasphemies, they were PEOPLE. They are victims. Victims of the Ascians. One would think you'd be on board due to this fact alone. That's precisely why we (The WoL and friends) are going there to save the Void, not to DESTROY THE VOID.

Seriously, was that entire rant necessary for you to tell me what basically boils down to 'ACKSHUALLY, I'm right and here's why'?

[Necrotica]

My point was, that Voidsent aren't MONSTERS Clerectic. Just like Sin Eaters, just like Blasphemies, they were PEOPLE. They are victims. Victims of the Ascians. One would think you'd be on board due to this fact alone. That's precisely why we (The WoL and friends) are going there to save the Void, not to DESTROY THE VOID.

Seriously, was that entire rant necessary for you to tell me what basically boils down to 'ACKSHUALLY, I'm right and here's why'?

Step one to saving the void. Gotta kill all these darn voidsent and bring in some uncorrupted colonists.

And really the emphasis is on the WERE people. They are now monsters. They are way passed the point of a flying pig saving them.

[Theodric]

If the game was willing to bend over backwards in order to save the Tempered - who were, not so long ago, written off as 'unsalvageable' - then I imagine that it's plausible for an attempt to be made to reach out to the Voidsent.

We've also already seen examples of 'friendly' Voidsent in the form of the Reaper avatar and if there's any truth to the theory that Gaelicats are Voidsent? Well, that's more than enough reason to move heaven and earth in order to save the Thirteenth!

[SannaR]

Galekittens were a creation made by an ancient. There's a quest or two where you deal with one. They were some kind of warning system. Tempered are partially unsalvagaeable. Anyone who had physical alterations to their physical form aren't save able. It's why people who were transformed into sin eaters weren't treatable. Unless you're going to say the average denizen of the 13 always looked like imps and ahriman. Which we know isn't the case.

[Theodric]

I'm aware of the origin of Gaelicats - I was referencing the joke on the Triple Triad card about them being Voidsent.

With that said, the trend lately has been for any impossibility to somehow suddenly have a solution so I'm not willing to write off the inhabitants of the Thirteenth as being 'unsalvageable' just yet. Some will no doubt be too far gone but there's a lot we don't know about the place and it's likely that there's pockets of survivors who have managed to hold out/find an alternative solution to their craving for aether.

It'd also be a good way to have various side stories merge in a grand conclusion since there's a few individuals on the First seeking a way to restore the Thirteenth.

[SentioftheHoukai]

If the game was willing to bend over backwards in order to save the Tempered - who were, not so long ago, written off as 'unsalvageable' - then I imagine that it's plausible for an attempt to be made to reach out to the Voidsent.

We've also already seen examples of 'friendly' Voidsent in the form of the Reaper avatar and if there's any truth to the theory that Gaelicats are Voidsent? Well, that's more than enough reason to move heaven and earth in order to save the Thirteenth!

I know that Phurbles were established to be Voidsent in a FATE, and the most nefarious thing they've ever done is steal men's hair!

[MikkoAkure]

I know that Phurbles were established to be Voidsent in a FATE, and the most nefarious thing they've ever done is steal men's hair!

According to the encyclopedia, phurbles are classified as elementals, not voidsent.

I also don't think reaper's voidsent is "good". We have a contract with it but as seen in the reaper quests, if you have a moment of weakness you will be taken over by your avatar.

I think the closest thing we have to a good voidsent is the Great Gourd from the All Saints' Wake events. Don't know how canon he is though. The Continental Circus themselves are more of the clumsy evil themselves since they want to take over the world but they suck at it.

[Cleretic]

The Reaper voidsent are definitely not good. Orcus was a Reaper's voidsent, and he might be the most absurdly evil thing we've ever fought. Not the most accomplished evil we've ever fought, granted (who gets that prize depends on your view of 'evil', but it probably either goes to Meteion or 'whatever Ascian enjoyed the Calamities the most'), but nobody can argue Orcus doesn't have the spirit. The most we have on the lore of the Avatar is the website lore saying that it's purely transactional--it eats the souls of things we kill, which is... actually really terrible now that we know how reincarnation works, that's permakilling to a level that not even the biggest villains of the game so far perform. I'm pretty sure they might actually be worse than most voidsent, which I think just go for aether.

I'm perfectly willing to agree that Voidsent could have some good in them, but... well, so far we haven't seen a shred of evidence for it, and they've had a hell of a lot of chances. And I wouldn't even see that as anything but a horrible tragedy with none of them at fault; after ten thousand years of a dog-eat-dog world fighting over scraps, where the only thing that's ever been rewarded is malice and cruelty, I'd hardly blame them for not having a shred of kindness left in them; even if that wasn't wiped out in the Flood of Darkness, it hasn't been rewarded in millennia. That isn't cruel or harsh; remember that we killed scores of Sin Eaters despite mourning who they were, because we knew that what was there is gone. There's no indication that voidsent are any different in that regard; I'd say that the difference is that some seem a bit more intelligent, but then I remembered Vauthry and Titania count as Sin Eaters.

You could potentially argue that, even worse than any individual world lost in a Calamity, the worst thing an Ascian ever did was cause THAT world.