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  1. #1
    Player
    Silver-Strider's Avatar
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    Mar 2015
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    Gridania
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    1,753
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    Silver Strider
    World
    Famfrit
    Main Class
    White Mage Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Shurrikhan View Post
    Quickened Aetherflow
    Well, I did try to experiment on how to bring back Quickened Aetherflow but quickly scrapped it because it further empowered oGCD heals and it caused Gauge to generate even more haphazardly. The only way such a system could work is if Energy Drain was its own system unbound by Aetherflow and that caused its own set of headaches. While still a tempting prospect, trying to create a functional system was something that would require a level of fine tuning that is better done in practice rather than on paper to get an actual feel of the changes, limitations, etc. It could absolutely work, the issue is figuring out HOW it would work that isn't just Toxicon but as an oGCD.

    Aetherflow is honestly the single biggest obstacle for a SCH redesign because of how intricately it is woven into the job. Between MP management, Healing abilities, Energy Drain and Gauge Generation, so many of SCH's facilities are so hindgent on it that any small adjustment throws the system into chaos, as we've seen with SE's past attempts to remove Energy Drain. It works because it has to, else SCH crumbles. I tried to remove it in several experiments, tried moving the focal point of the job on the fairies, even tried to make Aetherflow work like Addersgal but for some reason or another, every theory ended in failure.

    Make Aetherflow abilities CD based and remove Aetherflow? oGCD healing goes thru the roof since there is nothing keeping Lustrate in check from just being used alongside the other Aetherflow abilities, apart from whatever CD is added to it and then there's still Gauge and MP management to consider on top of what to do with Energy Drain. Have it function as a Fairy Swapping ability? Limits control of the Fairies. Maybe you want Selene for Mitigation or Eos for urgent healing? Well too bad. Have it function like Addersgal? Apart from the obvious homogeny, Energy Drain becomes problematic due to how easy it is to regulate its usage that rises SCH's DPS and make Gauge Generation into a bit of a joke.

    I both wish to congratulate and condemn the person that made that skill because I am truly at a loss.
    (1)

  2. #2
    Player
    Shurrikhan's Avatar
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    Sep 2011
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    12,885
    Character
    Tani Shirai
    World
    Cactuar
    Main Class
    Monk Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Silver-Strider View Post
    <Aetherflow nightmares in general>
    I feel like the hardest thing about something as integral as Aetherflow is to try to deal with it in any sort of function-first approach, let alone in isolation.

    Though I haven't has as much time as I'd like to progress it, my current approach for any broader SCH design improvements, much like for CNJ, is to first start at the roots and level the kit up over time, trying to find something compelling at each step of level progression, rather than taking a top-down approach.

    Given SCH's ACN roots, that seems to orient around very unique takes on MP. Of course, for any of that to be pulled off, MP needs to first be a mechanic beyond merely a rez charge meter (or, for that to be the case in more than a mere <5% of content).

    Which means, to have the liberty/license to make SCH far more compelling... I need to be able to tap into broader changes and fix the dysfunctional systems that surround it. RIP.

    Make Aetherflow abilities CD based and remove Aetherflow? oGCD healing goes thru the roof...
    Well, again, that'd just depend on the in-practice frequency and burst thereby made available. Given single cost and three charges thereof per minute, burst wouldn't likely be too affected. Their CDs would doubtless have to change, though. And, of course, you'd lose the ability to not only shift around forms of healing within that difference in cooldowns, but to trade out would-be excess healing (or, in a more ideal context, the ability to trade burst for sustain).

    Have it function like Addersgal? Apart from the obvious homogeny, Energy Drain becomes problematic due to how easy it is to regulate its usage that rises SCH's DPS and make Gauge Generation into a bit of a joke.
    This one seems the most lucrative question to follow.

    Consider: What would be the difference in affordance between (A) a 6-charge maximum Aetherflow that starts at 3 charges and builds a charge per 20s and (B) what we have now, apart from needing one fewer weave space per minute (which we had more than enough of anyways)?

    Between the current version and a 3-charge maximum Addersgall-like system, there's a faint difference, but only for dumping an extra 3 Energy Drains into even-minute bursts; for all other uses of Aetherflow, there'd be little to no practical reason to pool that many heals, given the efficiency you'd be giving up in leaving Soil, Excog, and Indom untouched.

    In terms of playflow, there's the obvious difference of "must hit button as near as possible to on CD (delaying at most 1-2 GCD during the second buff cycle only)," but, again, that's it.

    Surely we could do more with an active button-press being attached to our resource generation? Something to actually make that button-press good for more than a wonky trade-off for having an, effectively speaking, 6-charge limit?
    (0)

  3. #3
    Player
    Silver-Strider's Avatar
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    Silver Strider
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    Famfrit
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    White Mage Lv 100
    With Aetherflow removed, you would need to increase the CD of Aetherflow abilities but not so much so that it becomes detrimental to the Fairy Gauge system while also keeping them at least somewhat in line with other healers so as to not lower SCH's ability to heal adequately in high stress scenario. The most promising combination of these factors was 2 Lustrates on 30s CDs, 2 Sacred Soils on 60s, 1 Excog on 60s and 2 Indom on 60s, which is just AST's CD line up on steroids, even before accounting for fairy abilities. Any increase in CD or charge removals caused SCH to start to fall behind in its healing capabilities since I was working on an average uptime of 75% in terms of Broil/DoTs so as to give some wiggle room for less experienced SCHs. It worked the higher your uptime was but started to fall apart at lower increments and given prog can get messy at the drop of a dime, I didn't think it was wise to pursue it further.

    As for changing Aetherflow into Addersgal, the problem stemmed more from the other adjustments to the job I had made, such as Succor and Addlo being more useful and Blessing, and Covenant being on shorter CDs. You could get several additional casts of Fairy Abilities in that could substitute for other Aetherflow abilities instead, when coupled with Succor or Addlo, that you could use Energy Drain unabated and that it would be optimal to do so over using any of your Aetherflow Heals, that theoretically, I could completely axe all of the other Aetherflow abilities almost entirely, which became the case when I moved the uptime threshold up from 75%. Between the extra DoTs of Miasma, Bane and Shadowflare, 3 Energy Drains a minute for 7 minutes rises SCHs DPS into Tank Levels, with an estimation puting it just between PLD and WAR in terms of damage, i.e. more than any of the other healers could get close to.

    I couldn't make ED solely a sustain tool with no damage because locking sustain independent of healing would be disastrous for a healer and removing it entirely would just further homogenize SCH and SGE. I can't increase the CD on Fairy abilities since that causes Guage Overflow issues. I can't make Aetherflow abilities more lucrative because it defeats the point of making GCD heals more useful. Admittedly, it wouldn't be a problem if the Fairy Abilities and Gauge were left unchanged but creating the resource management mini game that is my suggested Fairy Guage is something that I would like to see become a thing, even if only to test the waters with and seeing if it could realistically work first before admitting defeat on it.
    (0)