This frequency of English localization issues is unacceptable

[Striker44]

idc it's been a year but for anyone who skips to the end of the thread ignore these people and check out this YouTube channel that goes over the correct JP lore, and hosts a playthrough re-translating the JP client version to English while picking apart Koji Fox's errors:

Both versions of the story were green-lighted by Square. There is no "correct" version or "errors"; there are simply some differences in the story that were approved by the developer, making both valid.

[Enkidoh]

Both versions of the story were green-lighted by Square. There is no "correct" version or "errors"; there are simply some differences in the story that were approved by the developer, making both valid.

^This. The English and JP versions are developed hand in glove and the JP version is not the "prime" version all other languages are direct translations of. It's been this way since 1.0. Like or not, that is not going to change.

[NozomiJoestar]

Normally this would be true however the depth to the amount of discrepancies and flat out omissions of story elements between ARR-StB EN had to be course corrected with a change of localize lead in ShB. By omission I mean entire sections of story and lines are presented in part or not at all in EN, including core concepts (Transcendence, how Blessings work, the handling of the foundations of the Dragonsong War, the invention of the Twelve being seen as a common religion instead of like Idols, the fact that Primals as a term is actually Idols manifested by imagination not faith etc) and the nuances of goals of factions such as the Ascians. Entire sections of the game's writing, characterizations, & lore building present in all versions are missing in EN during the ARR-StB expansions. Only in ShB onward was the EN version of the story brought more in line with the JP version, which had concepts that manifest in practice first planted from the very beginning of ARR. An EN player, and Only an EN player, flat out would not understand or be confused by concepts that seem to suddenly appear or appear without a clear line of build up in ShB onward because of previous omissions. Think of whenever you've read the EN story or saw others who did ask why theres such and such logical plot hole no one can really explain between certain story beats. This implies a lack of quality control. There is a misunderstanding of the canon when viewed as a whole for EN players that doesn't exist elsewhere. There is no 100% confirmed way we can know how much the JP side was aware of changes that were made, though there have been times Yoshi-P admits he had no clue a particular thing about the game isn't the same in EN (including the names of dungeons being changed like Haukke Manor). However crosschecking does prove EN to be so drastically opposed to the foundational structure and prose presented in other versions, that it suggests there was no thorough QA done. It is impossible for a majority of regions to purposefully share characterizations or story writing and have one region which does not. You don't hold multiple regions of your product to a standard with carefully tailored variations of language accounting for localization and then decide "Not for that region over there though change everything for them specifically. For those guys just make something else altogether." the kind of chaos that causes is why you have a QA team. The differences are changes to the core of the story, to the core of the world building, not like inevitable changes made adapting localization. It makes zero logical sense from a business stand point to knowingly do what has been done here. It is very likely that someone flat out just didn't check or check with the necessary scrutiny in order for a split of this magnitude to occur. It is very likely the EN ARR-StB was at the creative mercy of one team. I am of course presuming you responded in good faith and not malicious intent.

[SchwarzwaelderTorte]

While it is much less present than it used to be in ARR-SB, there are still stylistic changes done by the EN localization team in the current expansion that are a little baffling.
I only started noticing it when I switched to Japanese audio and realized that not only do subtitles not always 100% match, but sometimes the intended meaning is completely lost too.

For example, in Living Memory, Wuk Lamat ends her conversation with Namikka by saying "And one day...we'll meet again!", Namikka doesn't say anything back, Wuk Lamat just leaves, and then there's a long shot where everyone crosses the bridge except Namikka. That's how she says her final farewell to her. It's incredibly awkward, especially with that long, silent bridge cutscene.

But in Japanese, she says "それじゃ、いってくるぜ!" (which roughly means "Well then, I'm off!", and is also commonly used by children to announce to their parents that they're leaving the house, which is especially relevant here considering the relationship between the two characters) and much better illustrates the metaphor that is going on: Wuk Lamat is moving forward, crossing the bridge towards a hopeful future, leaving Namikka and the past behind.

In English they speak of reunion, in Japanese they speak of separation. Considering the line is followed by a scene displaying a literal and metaphorical separation, which version makes more sense?

(also lore-wise they can't ever really reunite, right? iirc there were similar discussions around the scene where Erenville says something similar to his mother, so I wouldn't be surprised if this was another confusion caused by localization)

By omission I mean entire sections of story and lines are presented in part or not at all in EN, including core concepts (Transcendence, how Blessings work, the handling of the foundations of the Dragonsong War, the invention of the Twelve being seen as a common religion instead of like Idols, the fact that Primals as a term is actually Idols manifested by imagination not faith etc) and the nuances of goals of factions such as the Ascians..

I'm very interested in this, particularly the blessing/echo/primal/deity stuff because Endwalker left me very "???", is there like a written summary somewhere of all the differences? I've only read an old reddit post about how drastically different Midgardsormr's first speech in ARR is.

[DPZ2]

But in Japanese, she says "それじゃ、いってくるぜ!" (which roughly means "Well then, I'm off!", and is also commonly used by children to announce to their parents that they're leaving the house, which is especially relevant here considering the relationship between the two characters) and much better illustrates the metaphor that is going on: Wuk Lamat is moving forward, crossing the bridge towards a hopeful future, leaving Namikka and the past behind.

This is why literal translation to English doesn't work.

You may understand the "deeper" meaning of the Japanese, given familiarity with cultural aspects to which the rest of the world has little or no clue. The poignancy you see within the scene in Japanese doesn't resonate without cultural familiarity.

"And one day ... we'll meet again!" is equivalent in sentiment, as a child in Japan fully expects to return at the end of the day.

Even the English version Final Fantasy 1 was not strictly true to the Japanese original.

[PorxiesRCute]

While it is much less present than it used to be in ARR-SB, there are still stylistic changes done by the EN localization team in the current expansion that are a little baffling.
I only started noticing it when I switched to Japanese audio and realized that not only do subtitles not always 100% match, but sometimes the intended meaning is completely lost too.

For example, in Living Memory, Wuk Lamat ends her conversation with Namikka by saying "And one day...we'll meet again!", Namikka doesn't say anything back, Wuk Lamat just leaves, and then there's a long shot where everyone crosses the bridge except Namikka. That's how she says her final farewell to her. It's incredibly awkward, especially with that long, silent bridge cutscene.

But in Japanese, she says "それじゃ、いってくるぜ!" (which roughly means "Well then, I'm off!", and is also commonly used by children to announce to their parents that they're leaving the house, which is especially relevant here considering the relationship between the two characters) and much better illustrates the metaphor that is going on: Wuk Lamat is moving forward, crossing the bridge towards a hopeful future, leaving Namikka and the past behind.

In English they speak of reunion, in Japanese they speak of separation. Considering the line is followed by a scene displaying a literal and metaphorical separation, which version makes more sense?

(also lore-wise they can't ever really reunite, right? iirc there were similar discussions around the scene where Erenville says something similar to his mother, so I wouldn't be surprised if this was another confusion caused by localization)



I'm very interested in this, particularly the blessing/echo/primal/deity stuff because Endwalker left me very "???", is there like a written summary somewhere of all the differences? I've only read an old reddit post about how drastically different Midgardsormr's first speech in ARR is.

いってくる literally means "I'm going and I'll be back", so yes, there is an implication of meeting again. It's what you say when you leave the house for the day intending to return later. We don't have a set phrase for that in English.

[Lorika]

Don't compare English localization to French one too much.

The French localization was very crappy at first. ARR is just plainly horrible, especially the patch (Midgardsormr monologue is almost complete nonsense with a lot of ommited or deformed things for exemple).
HW is a tad better but still have a lot of things ommited or deformed.

Stormblood get better and it's closer to JP text but it's not perfect. And from Shadowbringer it's really good, with some error from time to time, but thoses doesn't really affect the story.

[Valence]

I don't like the french localization out of fundamental differences in writing appreciation and I find the overall tone and syntax clumsy and amateurish at times which is why I play in EN. But one thing that I will always appreciate with the french translation is that it's (generally) extremely literal and has always been a good basis to fall back when I want to have an idea of what jp does since I unfortunately don't speak or understand japanese.

[Lorika]

I don't like the french localization out of fundamental differences in writing appreciation and I find the overall tone and syntax clumsy and amateurish at times which is why I play in EN. But one thing that I will always appreciate with the french translation is that it's (generally) extremely literal and has always been a good basis to fall back when I want to have an idea of what jp does since I unfortunately don't speak or understand japanese.

Ther is one thing that French localization do very well since the beginning : Quest and Achievement name based on French pop culture. There is a lot of pun based on saying, old TV advertisement, series, book, comics/manga/bande déssinée etc... and some are plainly hilarous.

[ArslanMalqir]

The idea that Venat—characterized fundamentally by her unending love for the world and all its creatures—was not motivated by her desire to save the new life that had been created by the second sacrifice, and more generally all life in the universe, is absolutely nonsensical. She was literally the woman who created the faction who argued against the sacrifices and continued to argue against continued reliance upon Zodiark to reproduce what had been lost instead of moving forward and accepting the suffering they had gone through. You say that her whole thing was a purely utilitarian plan to ensure that life could manipulate dynamis, but that's not a motivation, that's an goal.

Why would Venat want life after the Sundering to be capable of manipulating dynamis? Why would she ensure that she could always find Meteion no matter where she hid? Why would she set up events so that the people of the sundered world had a chance at defeating the being that wanted to end all life in the universe forever?

The answer is, very obviously, that she cares about life in general and wants it to continue existing. Based on the information she had and the concerns she had about what could be shared and who she could share it with, she made her choices to attempt to stop the Final Days, and was not successful. Then she attempted to convince the remnants of her people to avoid sacrificing the new life they had created to repopulate the star, and she was similarly unsuccessful. Finally, she went through with the Sundering, and in doing so created people who were able to manipulate dynamis and would have a chance at defeating Meteion—because Meteion wants to kill everything, and Venat doesn't want everything to die.

I understand that people's opinions aren't going to change, and that getting anyone who came out of Endwalker loathing Venat and her writing to think differently is a pointless exercise, but the absolute least that should be done in an argument is to be accurate about what is being argued. Yes, Venat confirms that part of the rationale behind the Sundering taking the form it did was to create beings that could manipulate dynamis, but unless you think Venat just did that for fun the obvious second part of that sentence is "So those beings would be able to defeat Meteion and stop her from ending all life in the universe", something Venat would only care about if...she cared about life in general.