SE bans twitch streamers but not actual cheaters?

[Gothicshark]

I think my biggest problem with the streamer bans is that SE had no issues with the wow streamers blowing up FF14 with a whole bunch of addons but now the decide that it is the right time to enforce the ToS after the wow hype is over. It once again shows that money is king and they didn't want to look bad to a new audience which was giving them a spike in subs and EW sales. It is why I have little regard for SE saying that the ToS matters now that the JP players were mad they didn't win the world first DSR kill and complained about addons.

Quick hot take.

This is not the first time SE has banned people publicly for stuff on stream, and they did ban a "former" WOW streamer for being openly toxic, on Discord. But generally the Dev team doesn't watch the Twitch & Youtube streams, they are only aware of what is reported, and they were happy for the increased traffic, but I doubt they have time to watch a twitch stream. The big reason this happened was the Dev team and Yoshi-P were watching the stream for the world first. This was a fairly large public event and lots of important people were watching.

Also there are degrees of bad. The UI fixes, and Speech Bubbles Addons, which violate the TOS harm no one, and frankly SE and the team should consider making those for the current UI as options. Damage Meters which do have positive uses are used as weapons by toxic people when they are allowed, and DBM style addons are counted as cheating esp in a progression raid. So there is a fairly substantial difference in levels of offense.

Honestly there are a couple of long time FFXIV streamers who use the bad Addons, but they are usually smart enough to hide them from their stream, even if they comment of their uses casually in their stream. The same Streamers btw who have done interviews with Yoshi-P, and are well aware of why the TOS says what it does.

Also many of the converted WOW streamers (not the trendy came here ones, but the ones who are here to stay.) Have publicly apologized for using some addons as they were unware of the issue in the community and the always present rage against addons some of us have. (ie former WOW players who have been here a long time, myself included.)

I will always report evidence of ACT or the DBM clone, I won't report Speech Bubbles. As I want the UI to include that option. Same with UI clean up Addons, or people using clothing mods for their own personal enjoyment (ie Viera Hat Mods, Sexy Male bodies, etc.), if you want a perfect screen shot, or RP session, that is all for you, I don't use any Mods or Addons, and I only fight against addons that impact others.

[Gothicshark]

...

Feels more like doing 150mph+ on a track while recording yourself for it and then penalized for using illegal mods during an unofficial race.

Well no, it was a fairly large public event, and was an attempt at world first. Even if SE doesn't have an "official Race", the "unofficial" Worlds first is a big deal, and very much a public spectacle. So if using a closed track example. It's basically someone Bringing a Self Driving car to The Daytona 500 and expecting NASCAR to ignore it.

[DPZ2]

I think my biggest problem with the streamer bans is that SE had no issues with the wow streamers blowing up FF14 with a whole bunch of addons...

Perhaps the WoW streamers you're thinking of did get banned and didn't mention anything to their listeners. I watched one such mention they got told off for having an add-on, including a few days out-of-game, and the guy went "sorry" and that was that.

Just because You Personally haven't heard about it, doesn't mean it doesn't happen.

[Gothicshark]

The difference is that the undercutting bots aren't announcing to the world that they are in flagrant violation of the TOS unlike Twitch streamers.

The secondary problem with the undercutting bots is that at a glance, nothing they are doing is against the TOS. Standing around isn't against the TOS. Being located near a summoning bell isn't against the TOS. Listing items on the MB isn't against the TOS. Undercutting by 1 gil isn't against the TOS. However, it is the bigger picture of the situation (standing at a summoning bell for hours (days?) on end, relisting every few minutes for the lowest price) that makes it humanly impossible.

Good luck getting a GM to sit there and verify this long enough.

They'd probably fix the problem if they converted the MB into an Auction House instead (FFXI style). And charge an upfront listing fee, so every relist kills the profit.

^^This^^

Things to kill Market Bots should be implemented.

1: Minimum post amount should not be 1 gil, but what a vendor would pay.
2: Upfront Fee.
3: Take the AH method used in SWTOR, the items are listed in a big pool, you buy the quantity you want taken from the lowest selling price (always), this kills Big Money transfers, and over charging on the Market, as the over priced cheap items are always the last to sell.

[DPZ2]

. snip

1. Really? What money-making bot goes out of its way to sell something worth 500 gil for 1 gil? What financial sense that that make? The default post amount is already the vendor price.

2. Let's say, oh, 15%? So that 1 million gil crafted armor piece would now cost 150,000 gil to post? Surest way to ensure nobody but Market Bots sells anything.

3. This is a sure-fire method to make the availability of crafting materials be a wasted effort, and that the only ones to profit will be the market bots who are already selling stacks of 99 for items at the lowest price.

[technole]

Perhaps the WoW streamers you're thinking of did get banned and didn't mention anything to their listeners. I watched one such mention they got told off for having an add-on, including a few days out-of-game, and the guy went "sorry" and that was that.

Just because You Personally haven't heard about it, doesn't mean it doesn't happen.

Maximum didn't get banned, he's just not returning to FFXIV at this time. He probably will at some point when he needs more content to do. Likely mod-free.

[Pells]

The difference is that the undercutting bots aren't announcing to the world that they are in flagrant violation of the TOS unlike Twitch streamers.

The secondary problem with the undercutting bots is that at a glance, nothing they are doing is against the TOS. Standing around isn't against the TOS. Being located near a summoning bell isn't against the TOS. Listing items on the MB isn't against the TOS. Undercutting by 1 gil isn't against the TOS. However, it is the bigger picture of the situation (standing at a summoning bell for hours (days?) on end, relisting every few minutes for the lowest price) that makes it humanly impossible.

Good luck getting a GM to sit there and verify this long enough.

They'd probably fix the problem if they converted the MB into an Auction House instead (FFXI style). And charge an upfront listing fee, so every relist kills the profit.

How do you know what their retainer names are? All you're seeing is somebody standing there for hours on end. You don't need a bot to afk.

[Gothicshark]

1. Really? What money-making bot goes out of its way to sell something worth 500 gil for 1 gil? What financial sense that that make? The default post amount is already the vendor price.

2. Let's say, oh, 15%? So that 1 million gil crafted armor piece would now cost 150,000 gil to post? Surest way to ensure nobody but Market Bots sells anything.

3. This is a sure-fire method to make the availability of crafting materials be a wasted effort, and that the only ones to profit will be the market bots who are already selling stacks of 99 for items at the lowest price.

1: You must not look at the markets much, if there is more than 20 of an item on the market, it inevitable always ends up lower than the vendor buy price. So much so most things end up under 100gil and most items are sitting a 1 gil on slower servers.
2: No piece of Crafted armor should be at 1 million gil. 100k maybe, but 1 million is taking the piss, I usually undercut people hard on items over inflated like that and make hundreds and sell them at 5k gil or less.
3: If you think this you sound like a part of the problem, not the solution. Cutting off people gouging the market is always a good thing.

[Inanegrain]

Well no, it was a fairly large public event, and was an attempt at world first. Even if SE doesn't have an "official Race", the "unofficial" Worlds first is a big deal, and very much a public spectacle. So if using a closed track example. It's basically someone Bringing a Self Driving car to The Daytona 500 and expecting NASCAR to ignore it.

It reminds me more of the fair "budget limiting mod" for F1 drivers where they aren't allowed to exceed the limit after some teams came in with advantages funded by money. I remember something odd that made it safer/easier was not allowed after a race with it.

There's a category for self driving cars that remind me of TAS speedruns.