Current Problem Parallels

[NekoMataMata]

A lot of feedback isn't constructive tho, and trends towards dev bashing and "just make it better"

A lot of it might not be but there's no reason to give the feedback that is constructive the same harsh treatment.

[BrokentoothMarch]

A lot of feedback isn't constructive tho, and trends towards dev bashing and "just make it better"

Though to be fair, it isn't really our job. I see a lot of people say "You need to provide constructive criticism!" No. I really don't. The playerbase can express discontent and it's up to, wild position I know, the project manager to gauge and figure out where the sore spots are that causes lashbacks so they can construct a plan to alleviate them. Yes, constructive criticism is helpful, but not mandatory and far from expected from it's community. I'm not here to create a thesis on what's wrong with the game. I'm here to play it. And if the game is becoming unfun because of decision made the by the devs, it's their job to figure out and reevaluate these decisions, not mine to offer a ten step plan to happy good time success.

[Valkyrie_Lenneth]

Though to be fair, it isn't really our job. I see a lot of people say "You need to provide constructive criticism!" No. I really don't. The playerbase can express discontent and it's up to, wild position I know, the project manager to gauge and figure out where the sore spots are that causes lashbacks so they can construct a plan to alleviate them. Yes, constructive criticism is helpful, but not mandatory and far from expected from it's community. I'm not here to create a thesis on what's wrong with the game. I'm here to play it. And if the game is becoming unfun because of decision made the by the devs, it's their job to figure out and reevaluate these decisions, not mine to offer a ten step plan to happy good time success.

OK, but they make changes based on said feedback, and a lot of people will come back here and complain about how that "wasn't what they meant"


So if you are going to do that.... Well, it's kind of on you lol.


"I hate this". And "this is why I hate this and what I would prefer" are two very different statements. One is useful and one is not. You don't have to right a dissertation.... A paragraph is enough generally lol....

[Jojoya]

It's not players telling other players to quit that sent WoW into an uncontrolled death spiral.

You're never going to have a hive mind where the player community agrees on what is best for a MMO (though there will be times they'll agree on what is exceptionally bad for it). If someone is not enjoying a game in its current state, then quitting to go play a game they do enjoy is the smart thing to do. Continuing to pay is passively saying "overall I am satisfied with game design".

It was developers paying more attention to their rock star egos than what players wanted that sent WoW into a death spiral. Even as subscriptions plummeted, the developers continued to ignore player feedback because they had decided they knew best. That's not to say that players are always right but when you have large groups of players leaving over very specific changes, you really need to stop and question if that was the right change to make instead of doubling down on it.

Blizzard chose to double down and they paid for that choice.

If you want to claim there were missteps in Endwalker, then state what you believe those missteps were. But also accept that there will be players who disagree with your personal opinion.

[VelKallor]

Didn't anyone tell the sound team that a song with lyrics is NEVER used in an MMORPG map? How many years have they been making MMORPGs to make such a grotesque mistake?

No.

No one ever has heard of that little "rule"..I certainly never have, Ive been around for decades. It isnt a mistake at all.

the scions dying again

They didnt die. They never died.

Their souls were swept up into Meteion's realm, in much the same way as their souls were pulled to the First

and a boss we've never heard of. Seriously, congratulations to whoever managed to cry with this fairy tale, you made whoever wrote this very happy, since there were scenes that said "please cry here".

I loved every minute, It all came together quite nicely. Did it make me cry? Yes. But not for the reasons you might think.

Death. Despair. Fear. Loss. Hope. Kind of an appropriate theme for the last two years, wouldnt you say?

Urianger's meeting with Moenbryda's parents resonated with me far far deeper than even i expected, as it echoed a VERY REAL event in my own life. So yes I cried, as it slammed back a memory i had buried for a long time...it takes a master storyteller to know when to be able to reach down into a players psyche and evoke those kinds of feelings.

Ishikawa Natsuko-san is a master of her art. I hope very much to meet her one day, I owe her a bow and a heartfelt thank you. She is a gifted and evocative storyteller in every sense.

I can no longer sell anything on the market board,

Um...I sell stuff every single day. Maybe your prices are too high?

But their priority is to ban streamers who are using mods.

Oh. This again.

When you:

Publically stream FF 14 content using mods and addons you have been TOLD NOT TO USE and / or were told "if you must use them then dont advertise it or show it", and then defy that warning, what did you EXPECT was going to happen?

I find it amusing, not to mention revealing, that this little fact has been overlooked

During the time that guy was hauled off to Mordion, one of his group member can CLEARLY BE HEARD saying "I told you". One of his own raid members had told him 'dont do this, you are asking for trouble"..and he did it anyway.

His own raid members had told him "dont show those addons on stream". How much more clear could it get?

There is only one person to bear any blame for that suspension and thats the guy who ignored multiple warnings to NOT stream with addons showing..who is NOW whining he got reported and suspended?

Agree with me or not, the streamer in question is responsible for what he got. When you are told again and again 'dont do this" and you go ahead and do it anyway, dont be surprised when karma comes calling.

Action, meet consequence.

[Adamantini]

No one ever has heard of that little "rule"..I certainly never have, Ive been around for decades. It isnt a mistake at all.

Maybe you should start to play more video games, and hear the background music.

I loved every minute, It all came together quite nicely. Did it make me cry? Yes. But not for the reasons you might think.

So I must believe that you can explain me better about the expansion's history. For example: Who is Zoldiark after all? How did Hydaelin imprison the Zoldiark on the moon? Why didn't Hydaelin save Hyth and Emet from being wiped out? Why does a blue meteion appear among the black meteions asking them to stop, and she is never mentioned again? What happened to the person who was turning in Foundation? Why did Hydaelin make the Ascians unsundered? After all, does Emet like Hydaelin or not? Why Hydaelin never told us anything about Meteion? What is "hear feel think" anyway? How many hours of gameplay did I have, and how many hours of cutscenes did I have?

They didnt die. They never died.

Turned to dust and my character was sad, while i knew they would return in 3 quests. Come on, Yshtola dies every expansion. It's getting boring for a scion to die or disappear.

Urianger's meeting with Moenbryda's parents resonated with me far far deeper than even i expected(...)

Yeah, yeah... Unnecessary drama. That scene had written "please cry"

Um...I sell stuff every single day. Maybe your prices are too high?

Or maybe your prices are too low.

blablabla about mod

Ok, and the bots? They will deal with them?


You may have loved the expansion, but it has flaws. Holes in the story (even the scions act weird), timing error (in the midst of the chaos, they thought it was a good idea to add cute and funny scenes), failure to finalize the content (LL is full of questions about the lore that they said they were ending in 6.0). For real? This expansion looks like it was written by 2 people, one wanted to make the story about the end of time, and the other about how cute loporrits are

[Saraide]

snip

It really does feel like at some point you lost the story and just refused to pay any attention afterwards. Lets try to TLDR through some of those questions atleast. Zodiark is a god created to fix the celestial aetherflow, effectively creating an aether shield to ward off the dynamis bombarding etherys. Afterwards they tried to sacrifice even more people to recreate their perfect utopia. Hydaelyn sundered him (and the world) which made him very weak. That allowed her to magically imprison him in the moon.
Hythlodaeus had already sacrificed his soul to Zodiark, she couldnt have saved him. While emet selch got away from the sundering on his own. The blue meteion is the one that didnt personally get corrupted by despair, the network just took over and drowned her out. When the network is destabilizing she can make her voice heard again but not for long. Ultimately the network's despair is defeated and she can fall silent. Why would she be mentioned again?
The person turning in the foundation is the blasphemy in the caster role story, I take it you just havent done that quest line.
Leaving Emet-Selch, Lahabrea and Elidibus unsundered is in parts time travel weirdness, they always needed to be there for the story to play out like this but who is to say that hydaelyn even had an oppurtunity to sunder them. There is nothing inherently stopping from the story playing out in a way that doesnt include ascians or rejoinings. My interpretation is that she never had the chance to sunder them and therefore we always would have had to deal with them.
Emet-Selch probably liked Venat (in his own cranky way) but her betraying the convocation put them in direct opposition.

Hydaelyn wanted us to find out the pieces of the puzzle for ourselves so that we would have the clarity and resolve to face despair itself. So that we would fight for ourselves and not just because someone told us to. Borrowed convictions crumbles easier in the face of overwhelming despair. Meteion also wasnt really relevant as long as zodiark was still alive.

"Hear, song of creations end. Feel, the sorrow of hope's demise. Think, and find your way in the darkness." It's a response and preperation for meteion when she says "I wish to hear your words, share your feelings, know your thoughts". We wont defeat her by power alone, we need to conclude her mission with atleast one hopeful planet.

Y'shtola never died, she used crack teleport magic twice, got heavily injured by zenos once and terraformed the path with her soul like the rest of the scions in ultima thule. Was she close to dying multiple times? yea sure

I am not surprised you didnt care for moenbryda's parents, you clearly didnt care for the story in general at that point. It is an important step for urianger tho. There's also a side quest about papalymo's dad. Those people still exist and telling the parents of your former comrades of their death shouldnt be a light hearted scene.
The lopporits only make sense if they are cute and approachable. They are supposed to welcome the people onto their new home on the moon, do you want the housekeepers to look approachable or do you want them to look like behemoths? At this point I get the impression you want the story to be bad to have excuse for not paying attention. You're just taking story points and ask 'why do they make sense, i dont want them to'.

[Adamantini]

It really does feel like at some point you lost the story and just refused to pay any attention afterwards.

Ok, Let's go again.

Zodiark is a god created to fix the celestial aetherflow, effectively creating an aether shield to ward off the dynamis bombarding etherys.

Okay, so what are your thoughts? Did he need those sacrifices? Is it his source of power? why did he need them to do this for him? And if he was this way because they made him this way, Hydaelin knew it was going to go wrong, she could have gotten better.

Hydaelyn sundered him (and the world) which made him very weak

Yeah, that everyone know. But the real question here is "How"? If she had the power to subdue a god, why didn't she do something to defend her people?

The blue meteion is the one that didnt personally get corrupted by despair, the network just took over and drowned her out.

If Meteion functions as a "single mind", having one off the grid is a plot hole.

The person turning in the foundation is the blasphemy in the caster role story, I take it you just havent done that quest line.

So why it's in the main quest?

My interpretation is that she never had the chance to sunder them and therefore we always would have had to deal with them

It's the end of a story. It cannot have "I think" "my interpretation". It's over, we were supposed to be sure

Hydaelyn wanted us to find out the pieces of the puzzle for ourselves so that we would have the clarity and resolve to face despair itself.
(...)"Hear, song of creations end. Feel, the sorrow of hope's demise. Think, and find your way in the darkness." It's a response and preperation for meteion when she says "I wish to hear your words, share your feelings, know your thoughts". We wont defeat her by power alone, we need to conclude her mission with atleast one hopeful planet.

For me Meteion had not been planned before. "protect, Zoldiark, Moon". 3 words, a series of doubts, a better ending. For years we would wonder "protect who? Zoldiark? But isn't Hydaelin good and Zoldiark bad? Moon? What's on the moon?"
In the end, everything would fall into place, much better than "hear, feel, think"

Y'shtola never died, she used crack teleport magic twice, got heavily injured by zenos once and terraformed the path with her soul like the rest of the scions in ultima thule. Was she close to dying multiple times? yea sure

independent, is already boring in the same way. Every expansion is the same thing. There's already a bet going on between my friends when Yshtola will "die", and a scion will disappear

(Continue)

[hagare]

I should probably use less butter.
It's starting to get concerning

[TaleraRistain]

There's not an issue with players coming to the forums to raise issues so much as the way they do it. They make a thread with their grievances. They may or may not insult the devs in it. Someone has a different opinion. Sometimes it's rude but sometimes it's perfectly polite. The person criticizing turns their vitriol on that person just because they don't agree. If the other person says they aren't bothered by X issue, then the person criticizing insults and degrades them for not seeing what they see. If the person is Hydaelyn forbid happy with a change, well here comes the dissertation on why they're wrong and should feel horrible about themselves.

You're even doing it in the OP.

"I'm happy so I don't care" is a perfectly valid response for someone to have. They don't see the things that you do as an issue so they're just giving their opinion as you are. All you have to do to have successful interactions is just understand that others may have differing opinions and so long as everyone respects that then points can be debated civilly.