Just remove healers.

[ThorneDynasty]

Only WAR and DRK have an issue with overlapping playstyles and unga-bunga spammy bursts (and it's completely fine for 1 tank to play like that, so really the issue is DRK). And even WAR and DRK do at least have bursts. So that's 50%/75% of the tanks being basically fine compared to 0% of the healers. And no, I refuse to call blood lily and energy drain optimizations proper bursts.

[TabrisOmbrelame]

[B]


[1]Universal action: Remedy. Removes a single detrimental effect from self. 20s CD.
[2]Universal action: Standard-issue Potion. Restores own HP, 2000 potency, increasing up to 4000 as own HP decreases. (should be about 25~50% of HP). 3 charges. 15~30s recharge (Adjust as necessary).
[3]See above.
[4]Healing debuff expires before you actually need to be healed for the following mechanic. See above.
[5]See above. If you actually knew about the mechanic you'd know it gives you a healing output buff, there's no reason that wouldn't affect this.
[6]Exactly! Good to see you understand, friend!
And just as a freebie, I'll throw in a problem you didn't address: What about deaths? In standard group content, all players receive two stacks of "Reraise". Each stack allows you to resurrect yourself upon death and gain weakness, as if you were resurrected normally. Any further deaths will necessitate the aid of another player, such as through Verraise, Resurrection, Arise, etc. Leaving combat replenishes all expended stacks of Reraise.

Not further responding to TabrisOmbrelame unless he starts demonstrating an ability to fully read and understand the posts he responds to.

You talk about action that aren't in the game "now". It's easy to just make speculation when you base this on nothing. I can invente action too, It's not that hard to do just that (In fact, you didn't invented that, You just take things already in the game, adding CD, and taking the PvP healing option). You said that Healer is outright "Unplayable" in the current state of the game, So I guess you don't need all the action you proposed before, do you ?

Let me ask a question, Mister Big brain, How do you intend to pass a healer mecanics without healer Right now, without any modification, how could you even survive that ? Every shield, mitigation, potion and self sustaining ability wouldn't save DPS. It is know that "Full tank" Group may do it, nothing new... But not for DPS.

What YOU don't understand is that I'm talking about the design of the game right now, not in your fantasmagoric idea of removed healer. If you wish to remove healer, you better have some really good argument for this because you'll have to make WHM, AST, SGE, SCH Caster DPS. Since you want to just throw away healer, Let me see how you are able to make those 4 class as DPS up to level 90 with unique gameplay for each of them.

Again, Removing a role isn't a solution at all. You just randomly spit that out of your mouth without thinking about further consequence on what will happen after this. Did you even tried to make suggestion like Silver-Strider was doing for years ? Did you tried to make healer great ?

Ransu have a pretty good point. And I'll go even further, If you wish that badly to remove healer, let's remove tank, We don't need heal, because damage doesn't exist (Sarcasm in case you don't know what it is)


Healers need a rework, not a remove. I highly doubt that SQEX will ever remove Healer.

[Icecylee]

"why aren't you guys making suggestions to improve things instead of being upset and suggesting we just remove the rot and give everyone self healing tools (((" lmao as if people haven't been doing that for 6+ years while also being ignored entirely the whole time.

[CrimsonGunner]

i said it once before, the road healer role is heading towards right now is oblivion wheter we like it or not (either SE removes it or the community will outright shun healers for being useless in groups).

no offense to hoping and perhaps seeing a glimmer of change but right now, as silver-strider said healers were given the least treatment of all the jobs that exists.

sge is simply sch kit without the clunkiness that was introduced.
the only thing sch got as an improvement is expidient(which needed to be sold in a LL cause the action trailer for sch was super lame) and the fairy actually responsive(compare to 6 gcd delays for the entire shb expansion).
instead of improving ast they added needless button bloat, ignored ast feedback and added rng out of spite instead of actual proper rng management.
all of whm gcd healing spells are basically the worst version of ast gcd healings, cast times longer then ast, mp cost higher then ast while his potencies are the same as spells even gravity compare to holy,gravity wins with being ranged and allow weaving while whm only has stun.

i am done with believing they will change, SE never even tried to proper maintain healers in jobs just throw something to the masses like dogs and see them eat the slops hoping it will quell their barks.
yoshi p actions only show further bias and uncare nature towards healers and it doesn't matter if he means it or not its happening with statements like "we havent found nothing to do to sch" after a lot of feedbacks or "go play ultimate" when regard to healer engagement, even in shb their fix to seraph was add 2 seconds while bahamut got his animation issue fixed.

my opinion right now is hope and believing SE fixing healers wont bring help anymore, if we really want our jobs to be properly taken care and maintain ,we need to abandon the healer role and let them revamp the role as a support perhaps or force them to actually work their kits if they want to avoid handling encounter design for all their dungeons/trials/raids to fit 0 healers and healers only mechanics

[Colt47]

They did talk about this before when people were mentioning how other competing games made healer sort of like how we have tanks, where they dps but also provide healing. Basically, they can't get rid of healers as they are because they'd have to nerf dps across the board for all dps and tanks just to balance out the fact healers now are expected to do damage, and then the fact the fights themselves are built around the healers having really insane levels of healing through comboing abilities. If they just buffed the heals to compensate the fights would turn into black and white mitigation strats, where a healer could heal someone from 1 to full super easy, so the only challenge is hitting enough mits so they don't fall over.

[ThorneDynasty]

They did talk about this before when people were mentioning how other competing games made healer sort of like how we have tanks, where they dps but also provide healing. Basically, they can't get rid of healers as they are because they'd have to nerf dps across the board for all dps and tanks just to balance out the fact healers now are expected to do damage, and then the fact the fights themselves are built around the healers having really insane levels of healing through comboing abilities. If they just buffed the heals to compensate the fights would turn into black and white mitigation strats, where a healer could heal someone from 1 to full super easy, so the only challenge is hitting enough mits so they don't fall over.

A) Having a decent DPS kit doesn't mean the overall damage has to be high, no one has complained that healers do too little damage.

B) Rebalancing DPS is something they do all the time anyway, so that can't possibly be an insurmountable challenge. And it's even easier to do on a party level - you just boost enemy health according to 2 party members doing x% more avg damage without even having to touch the jobs themselves.

C) You don't need to lower healing output just because you make room for DPS skills. Lower cooldowns, faster resource build up, etc. are all options.

[Colt47]

A) Having a decent DPS kit doesn't mean the overall damage has to be high, no one has complained that healers do too little damage.

B) Rebalancing DPS is something they do all the time anyway, so that can't possibly be an insurmountable challenge. And it's even easier to do on a party level - you just boost enemy health according to 2 party members doing x% more avg damage without even having to touch the jobs themselves.

C) You don't need to lower healing output just because you make room for DPS skills. Lower cooldowns, faster resource build up, etc. are all options.

It has to do with the design of the game itself and I never said the output would be lowered, I'm saying that if they compensate for reducing the number of healing abilities it pushes the fight design far more towards mitigation. If you look at SWTOR and how they did the classes they all kind of do a lot of the same thing, but have a few role specific traits. FFXIV each job is like deep diving into that specific role so they base the fight design around that aspect.

[Nizzi]

Yeah it's cool that you can't clear P3-4S or DSR without healers yet but 1 to 6 people are forced to play these roles for casual content or else the queue will never pop, and I sure don't want to spend the next 30m in Aglaia pressing Broil Broil Broil Broil Broil Broil Broil Broil, so where do we go from here?

[Sunhwapark]

next 30m in Aglaia pressing Broil Broil Broil Broil Broil Broil Broil Broil, so where do we go from here?

We remove broil going into the next expansion of Shadowbringers 3: The Musical 7.0, the new stress free rotation is: Biolysis > wait 30s > Biolysis
Feel free to sprinkle in Energy Drain wherever you want, if it still exists at that point too.

[UkcsAlias]

To make healers required they can do a few things:

Scale values on difficulties! Mitigations on normal mode could be 10, 20% on hard. etc. This automaticly also makes the skill required for good timing on them higher on more difficult duties. A good example where this works is for example in borderlands. Slag in that game gets boosted on UVHM (normaly it adds 100% damage, then its 200% for any non slag weapon. With a bonus of 50% for overapplying of slag). It realy brings the focus to having a dedicated slagger in the team, or spread this aspect since in UVHM it essentialy is mandatory. In that game there is no dedicated healer though, but most classes can talent into slagging at some point.

Add more consistent waves of damage from bosses. The current spikes with long delays between them make self sustain too effective. By making the enemies do more consistent damage, jobs wont be able to sustain themselve anymore. It gives the healer more teammates to target, and by that reduce the need for constant DPS.

And adding to that: Give healers boosts when the team is at full/high health. This makes an efficient team boost the healer, while a less effective team can get healed. This can be done by extra abilities, or just dynamic potency values. If for example broil would deal bonus damage equal to the total health of the team (as percentage), you can create a more dynamic state for the healer in which they are effective.
For example: 200+(totalteamhp% / 4), which can be worded as: 200 potency + 1 for each 4% of health a player in the party has. Which enables a potency value of 600 in trials. And these values can also be scaled on lvl.
It might not work for the most optimized teams on that (which is still less than 1% of the players), but in turn, balance generaly breaks with such teams anyway.

Adding a button to the healer dps rotation on that could add more variety in button presses, which is a diffirent solution for the more effective teams, or lower difficulty dungeons. Giving some rotation here can even enable a few more effects (ie. 2 dps buttons allow a 3rd ability which allows you to heal a teammate, and apply bonus damage towards his next attack).

But in the end, if teams can simply dodge most damage, healing is generaly going to be reduced anyway. Something that in trials and later dungeons to some degree has been improved, but is still a key aspect in balancing healers. If all damage is avoidable, the need for a healer is also avoidable. This is still the main issue.