Onsal Hakair - Paladin Cheese should be looked into

[Raraka]

Trying to collapse info from a couple of threads into a more specific and condensed quick guide to what is the cheese and how can you fight against it.

First, here's a video of how it lookslink

What is happening in the clip is that paladins can use cover to redirect all damage coming to your guarded target into themselves, then use Limit break to become invulnerable to all damage.

The thing with Onsal Hakair however, is that you need to take some sort of damage to have your capture cast interrupted, so covering an ally will allow them to capture while redirecting all damage to the paladin.

How do we deal with it?

The best way you can go around dealing with this is by pushing the paladin away from the covered target, so MCH, MNK, WAR, and other classes with pushbacks can make the ally vulnerable again. Another couple of options are RPR and DNC Limit breaks, anything that can make the paladin get away from where their ally is will work.

My intent with the post is to bring it to the attention of SE to consider patching out this interaction in the future (Possibly 6.15?), as it feels very cheesy/not intended, and to spread a bit of knowledge of how can you deal with this in case you see it on your Onsal Hakair roulettes.

[ThaCa]

I think it's listed as accepted bug for now. The worse part of it is that they don't even need the Limit Break. As long as they have a friend to coordinate with just Guardian + Guard is enough to cap most points.

If there's only one group doing it, it might be worth going MNK because their LB charges fast and breaks the shield allowing people to just burn them both out.

Alternatively your team needs to play smarter and intercept them from far enough to not allow the setup in the first place. With PLD LB it's even harder to stop.

It's really cheesy but most people are too busy playing SMN and SCH chasing damage and kills to care. It definately needs fixing at some point though, but it might take until Frontline rework to have it.

[Neoyoshi]

I dislike that it's happening, but if it's listed as an acceptable thing to do for now, all we can do is adapt around that strategy and either be more aggressive with making sure that the strategy isn't successful when we see it, or.... i don't know what.

If it's true that my Limit Break can actually break that shield, then I'll definitely keep that in mind.

[Mistress_Irika]

Definitely looks like a bug.
Hallowed Ground and Cover is a thing. It always has been a thing.
However, Cover doesnt negate crowd control. So I'm a bit confused as to how the WHM in that video wasnt affected by all the other WHMs lasering the both of them. I didnt see a single Purify being used...

[Nanne]

Hallowed Ground and Cover is a thing. It always has been a thing.However, Cover doesnt negate crowd control.

Isn't that just Hallowed negating all CC? People used Cover+Hallowed to stop melee LB's being interrupted in Stormblood Feast team season and probably even before that too

[Knot_D]

Reaper's LB also work to make the PLD who use guard while cover goes away

[ReiganCross]

I think Mesotes capping should be the best form of that, because it feels like Mesotes should be perfect for that. So I mean that damage shouldn't interrupt a cap if it deals no damage due to Invulnerability such as Mesotes, or deals 0 damage because of Barriers.

But Cover-Guarding is just way too cheap. I honestly think that the damage coming from Cover should just be un-mitigatable. So even if you Guard, Hallow, whatever, if the other guy takes damage, you take the damage as he would... Y'know, like regular Cover. You can't use Cover to Hallow Ground someone else on PvE, no Idea why it works on PvP. Your Cover target's mitigation should be what count when accounting for damage coming from that connection. Also, Guard should also break the Cover, the effects end as soon as you put Guard up, so it would only really be safe to do that with the LB or against fewer targets than, y'know, 48 people.

I wouldn't know what to do if the target of the Cover is ALSO invulnerable, though. So the Hallowed Paladin could take a cover and still transfer no damage to his Covering buddy, who then could also HG and take as many CCs as he wanted as long as the cover still held. And yeah the Covering guy could be yeeted, but most knockbacks are kind of rare and aren't really reliable to throwing people in the right place. So... I dunno how to solve that.