Console Players don't need Addons

[LittleImp]

Watching a guide is cheating if we go that way.

Guides don't tell you exactly what to do, in real time, based exactly on what is happening in your instance in real time. Stop being disingenuous.

Ok now do all of those mechanics. Should be easy right? The bot tells you what it is so you should instantly know what to do and how to do it perfectly.

In the case of this mechanic, it's literally just walking your character to a marker which Cactbot automatically and instantly tells you to go to. Most of the player interaction of that particular mechanic is in reading it, just like 5head in EX3. I think you are under the false assumption that because you still happen to struggle with the game despite using Cactbot, that others must share that experience.

[IkaraGreydancer]

Idk...no matter how you spin it you have and advantage over everyone else. Idc if it's just buff timers (even though I've heard there's a mech thats made null when having said knowledge but not sure how true that is), if you are accessing info the game itself isn't giving you at all or as easily I'd say that falls into the unfair camp. The fights are designed and completed without add ons in mind.

I'm not gonna call all of you cheaters but it is scary how so many people rely on add ons

[IdowhatIwant]

Idk...no matter how you spin it you have and advantage over everyone else. Idc if it's just buff timers (even though I've heard there's a mech thats made null when having said knowledge but not sure how true that is), if you are accessing info the game itself isn't giving you at all or as easily I'd say that falls into the unfair camp. The fights are designed and completed without add ons in mind.

I'm not gonna call all of you cheaters but it is scary how so many people rely on add ons

Buff timers are actually given in the game. They are just a pain to view for your party members as you have to actually target them to see the timer.
So it's not really game info that is hidden, the mod just makes it more conveniently placed, which this is hopefully one of the changes they will do.

The game should also give addition information on some things such as your crit chance, and direct hit chance, with out a parser there is no way to accurately get this with out going through the logs and doing a bunch of math that should just be readily available for you.

[game_enjoyer]

just real quick, not sure if anyone has said this BUT:

console players not having access to tools PC players have is not console players not needing them

it is console players having to make due with insufficient tools

[novamare]

Genuine question here, as someone just out of sprout territory (and certainly not anywhere close to high level endgame content): doesn't "cheating" imply cheating others out of something? It's my impression that very little in this game is zero-sum in the sense that one player's success demands another player's failure. Exceptions are PvP and, I suppose, world first races--although the rewards there seem to be limited to bragging rights.

So even if addons make content easier for some players--because the line between what is "just QoL" and what is "game altering" is gray and mercurial--is it really "cheating" that directly and negatively impacts the gameplay experiences of others? Does a player clearing with addons materially devalue the clear of someone playing without them?

I know this might be an overly nitpicky semantic distinction, but I find it hard to agree with arguments that rely on an assumption that "cheating" in this sense is inherently detrimental.

Maybe this is just my live-and-let-live tendencies (and the fact that I've had to remind kids in my life that it's just a game), but as long as addons are not necessary for content, and that the players who use them aren't directly and negatively impacting the gameplay of others, I don't really see the point in demonizing them...

Do folks really care that other players choose to experience the game and clear content in a different way than they did? Are there some higher stakes, beyond pretty weapons and bragging rights, to this that I'm missing?

(Also, this isn't a discussion the ToS, or the enforcement of the ToS by SE; it's more about the moral(?) outrage from some folks about this whole drama.)

[SwingLifeAway]

Genuine question here, as someone just out of sprout territory (and certainly not anywhere close to high level endgame content): doesn't "cheating" imply cheating others out of something? It's my impression that very little in this game is zero-sum in the sense that one player's success demands another player's failure. Exceptions are PvP and, I suppose, world first races--although the rewards there seem to be limited to bragging rights.

Wow, an actual well thought out take from a sprout dismantling the entire argument made by veterans of the game. Embarrassing for the community tbh lmao.

Cheating in general is kinda cringe, your sentiment is correct but in MMOs a lot of value is tied into achievements. The thing is though that the plugins the raiding community wants to be allowed, are just really basic things that aren't cheating in anyway. Good luck convincing people who don't raid though.

And I hope you continue to enjoy the game despite what you might find on the forums, it's really not representative of the entire community.

[SleepyHomieAria]

Genuine question here, as someone just out of sprout territory (and certainly not anywhere close to high level endgame content): doesn't "cheating" imply cheating others out of something? It's my impression that very little in this game is zero-sum in the sense that one player's success demands another player's failure. Exceptions are PvP and, I suppose, world first races--although the rewards there seem to be limited to bragging rights.

Ah but see, your problem is assuming that everyone talking about this topic isn’t arguing in bad faith or trolling. Indeed, some people really have nothing better to do with their lives.

[Catnipx]

So why do you?

Do I need shinier and less plebby toys? Yes!
Why do I need them? Because I can!

Bye Felicia!

[DarkPursuer]

ITT: OP has multiple bad takes and gets filtered immediately in the first reply alone.