Rescue needs to go away.

[Raoabolic]

This might be a strange suggestion but has anyone reported grief rescuing? Just sayin', lol.

[Rein_eon_Osborne]

Answer this: do you get rescued so often to the point you're paranoid of running with random DF healers? To the point you have to keep targeting your healers to see who they're targeting? To the point you're this insecure? How many times you actually get rescued vs when you actually don't see it in your runs?

Arm's Length/Surecast lasts like 5 seconds and I have to predict when a person is going to use it. That's really not going to happen. Those skills are used when you know a KB is happening and want to defend against it. A bad Rescue can't be predicted.

Enlighten me when you said 'bad Rescue': does it mean a badly timed rescue that leads to death/loss of time? or is it rescues that are used solely for griefing/trolling?

If it's the former, then yes, it's easier to predict. You CAN predict when this will happen, especially if it's coming from inexperienced healers. Their sole intention will be to pull you out of what they deem as dangerous when it is not. This is completely alright. They do not mean harm. They have to use it one way or another to practice using Rescue properly, otherwise how do you think the best Rescuer made it their way to where they are right now? But I don't pay your sub nor I am you, so I do not get to dictate how you should feel. I could also argue that i.e. skills like PLD's Cover made it harder to heal them (not really, but I can see how it'll surprise inexperienced healers) because it causes them to take an extra damage spike and throw my routine healing off. As people says: YMMV. This is just my honest opinion.

On the other hand, the latter is a silver platter handed to you to report said trolling healer. Yes, you can't always predict them as reliably as the former because their sole intention will be to pull you into hazardous objects/zones which can translate to several things. But you can report them for doing this. It doesn't take long to file in the report.

[LeonKeyh]

I guess you also dislike shirk on the tanks then.

That's a horrible example since the only way shirk could possibly cause any issue in and of itself is if the tank didn't have their stance on, and at that point, shirk isn't what would matter. Shirk gives someone 25% of your enmity, so it's not possible to shirk an enemy to someone unless you're already very close in enmity (i.e. the tank stopped attacking or didn't have tank stance on).

Then hit Arm's Length or Surecast if you're so against someone pulling you out of the Bad to avoid having to waste resources raising your corpse or healing you back from the brink. The game provides a tool to avoid Rescue's draw-in effect - use it.

God, you people are ridiculous.

That is a ridiculous suggestion. Rescue has no "wind up," you can't predict when someone else is going to use it. Are you suggesting using Arm's Length/Surecast everytime someone thinks that they may get rescued?

A small pulling tank is not griefing. They're pulling mobs and maintaining aggro and helping burn the mobs down.

And they're especially not griefing in cases where the dps are fine with the pace and it's just the impatient healer who isn't. As people are so fond of saying on this forum, majority rules. That healer is outvoted.

I guarantee you the "majority" want the dungeon to go as quickly as possible. I doubt there's a world where you would ask BOTH DPS "Do you want this dungeon to take 20 minutes or 30 minutes?" where they would say "30 minutes!"

[Renalt]

Answer this: do you get rescued so often to the point you're paranoid of running with random DF healers? To the point you have to keep targeting your healers to see who they're targeting? To the point you're this insecure? How many times you actually get rescued vs when you actually don't see it in your runs?



Enlighten me when you said 'bad Rescue': does it mean a badly timed rescue that leads to death/loss of time? or is it rescues that are used solely for griefing/trolling?

If it's the former, then yes, it's easier to predict. You CAN predict when this will happen, especially if it's coming from inexperienced healers. Their sole intention will be to pull you out of what they deem as dangerous when it is not. This is completely alright. They do not mean harm. They have to use it one way or another to practice using Rescue properly, otherwise how do you think the best Rescuer made it their way to where they are right now? But I don't pay your sub nor I am you, so I do not get to dictate how you should feel. I could also argue that i.e. skills like PLD's Cover made it harder to heal them (not really, but I can see how it'll surprise inexperienced healers) because it causes them to take an extra damage spike and throw my routine healing off. As people says: YMMV. This is just my honest opinion.

On the other hand, the latter is a silver platter handed to you to report said trolling healer. Yes, you can't always predict them as reliably as the former because their sole intention will be to pull you into hazardous objects/zones which can translate to several things. But you can report them for doing this. It doesn't take long to file in the report.

Oh you can predict when it's being used? Neat. I'd like to see this first hand. You on Aether? I wanna test this prediction skill of yours.

[Semirhage]

"Here's an entire role that's ostensibly tasked with supporting the party and fixing mistakes. But because fixing mistakes affects me, every single instance of that mistake fixing must be vetted through MY desires first, no skills that allow you to affect me in any way I don't like should be allowed!"

This is why DPS players shouldn't design healers, and why DPS players designing healers has led to their watered-down, boring state. Maybe, just maybe, the healer role shouldn't be designed around what the DPS deign to allow them to use.

[BaconBits]

"Here's an entire role that's ostensibly tasked with supporting the party and fixing mistakes. But because fixing mistakes affects me, every single instance of that mistake fixing must be vetted through MY desires first, no skills that allow you to affect me in any way I don't like should be allowed!"

This is why DPS players shouldn't design healers, and why DPS players designing healers has led to their watered-down, boring state. Maybe, just maybe, the healer role shouldn't be designed around what the DPS deign to allow them to use.

Just say the word and I will throw them into the Gulag.

[technole]

No. This is another one of those "i never seen it get used it right, so its worthless" baloney.

Sage and Rescue can have two players swap places with right timing
DRU, get someone on the correct side for sancity
E11S fix some stranger or pull from aoe to safety

list goes on, get real or good.

[VerdeLuck]

Sage and Rescue can have two players swap places with right timing

Sage swap is easily the most abused version of this I've seen, and had it done to me quite a few times while tanking roulettes. It has absolutely no risk and lets a Sage survive while putting another player into an instant kill mechanic like meteor or ancient flare.

[technole]

Sage swap is easily the most abused version of this I've seen, and had it done to me quite a few times while tanking roulettes. It has absolutely no risk and lets a Sage survive while putting another player into an instant kill mechanic like meteor or ancient flare.

Pulling people to death situations is reportable, that's not on the skill though.

Aiding the enemy / Uncooperative behavior / Lethargic behavior
Refers to an act of performing actions that give an advantage to an enemy (monsters, or the opposing team/players in PvP content) by not performing the necessary gameplay required of the situation. This may be combined with combat sabotage as well.

There are mechanics where people need to be on the right side or got on the wrong side.

[Amarande]

The trouble with Rescue is that, outside of pre-planned strat uses (one of the Alphascape Savage raids had a strat that used this, IIRC?), it's just too clunky to actually get used in 98+% of the cases that you might actually have wanted to, simply because of XIV's server system.

Let's see what has to happen for Rescue to "work" correctly: the healer needs to notice someone is in danger, then target them, then hit the Rescue button, it seems simple enough but let's look at it a different way:

* Reaction time for the healer player to notice the situation.
* Input time for the healer to target the in danger teammate (this is fast on KB&M, but we know how clumsy targeting can get as a healer on controller)
* Input time for the healer to hit the actual rescue button (this on the other hand will almost certainly be faster on controller, since the infrequency with which rescue is used means that it's probably on an awkward keybind for the KB&M player)
* Server response time for the Rescue action to be registered.
* Potential ground AOEs in the path of the Rescue (blame dragoons in T8 for why we can't have nice things)
* Server response time for the rescuee's final location to be registered.

All of which has to happen in between the healer noticing someone's in danger, and before the snapshot time for the mechanic about to be failed (otherwise you pull them out of the mechanic that they still get hit by anyway because XIV is wonky that way).