The probllem with new classes

[syntaxlies]

Ive been really excited for any sort of new class even before SE ever mentioned anything about them. that being said does this game even have room for more classes, most endgame content is based around 3-4 jobs that are maximized for the current content. If we get another mage class it will be mostly buffer/enfeebling most likely. Would it be so effective so make a party ditch a BLM for it. Is there any room at all for a SMN in endgame. Could anything new compete with what we have now? Obviously balance is key and SE has yet to prove they can do it. Only time will tell i guess.

Anyways im still excited for anything new and hope they prove useful without making anything else obsolete.

[Elexia]

End-game in FFXIV:

THM(BLM)(Always stacked, doesn't need to be.)
WAR (Standard tank, even though PLD does just fine.)
ARC(BRD) (Always stacked, doesn't need to be.)
WHM (standard slot)

So it's not built around a set number of classes, it's built around what will be an auto-win button to the community and people denied this up and down for years with MMOs, Garuda was able to be burned down by BLMs and it pretty much threw their lie back in their face.

There's plenty of room for new classes, there always is, the problem is if the community will stop being retarded and actually utilize different strategies even if they don't work the first or 2nd time, everything has a flow you have to get into (though luckily the minority of the community actually try different things.)

Is there any room at all for a SMN in endgame

How does SMN work in XIV? We don't know. If you're basing it on how XI's work currently, plenty of room for it, especially if they keep the same general mechanic:

-Damage
-Crowd Control
-Minor Healing if needed
-Group Buffs
-Crowd Debuffs
-Aura Effects that also grants buffs

Plenty of room if people stop stacking classes. Yes you have 8 slots, no that doesn't mean 3 need to BLM.

[syntaxlies]

End-game in FFXIV:

THM(BLM)(Always stacked, doesn't need to be.)
WAR (Standard tank, even though PLD does just fine.)
ARC(BRD) (Always stacked, doesn't need to be.)
WHM (standard slot)

So it's not built around a set number of classes, it's built around what will be an auto-win button to the community and people denied this up and down for years with MMOs, Garuda was able to be burned down by BLMs and it pretty much threw their lie back in their face.

There's plenty of room for new classes, there always is, the problem is if the community will stop being retarded and actually utilize different strategies even if they don't work the first or 2nd time, everything has a flow you have to get into (though luckily the minority of the community actually try different things.)



How does SMN work in XIV? We don't know. If you're basing it on how XI's work currently, plenty of room for it, especially if they keep the same general mechanic:

-Damage
-Crowd Control
-Minor Healing if needed
-Group Buffs
-Crowd Debuffs
-Aura Effects that also grants buffs

Plenty of room if people stop stacking classes. Yes you have 8 slots, no that doesn't mean 3 need to BLM.

but when SE implements 25 speed chest of course people are gonna go with whatever gets the job done fastest.

[darkstarpoet1]

i think there's room for more, but i more question the ability of the dev team to be able to put them in with a balance that they are viable without just being the new classes that people stack.

[syntaxlies]

i think there's room for more, but i more question the ability of the dev team to be able to put them in with a balance that they are viable without just being the new classes that people stack.

that's pretty much what i mean. Right now we have 7 with about 3-4 not being optimal for content at any given time. If they add 3 more i don't think it will change that. I am curious to so how it pans out in the long run though.

[AceofRains]

:3 My Job Guide has a great setup for new classes, but not only that, jobs are pretty diverse in roles because each class has 3 jobs to chose from. So for instance if you cant get an archer -> bard, an arcanist -> time mage may be a good replacement. Or if you cant find a conjuerer -> white mage, a pugilist -> dancer would make an effective party healer/enfeeblist.

Hard to explain but take a look at the guide its pretty good :]

[syntaxlies]

:3 My Job Guide has a great setup for new classes, but not only that, jobs are pretty diverse in roles because each class has 3 jobs to chose from. So for instance if you cant get an archer -> bard, an arcanist -> time mage may be a good replacement. Or if you cant find a conjuerer -> white mage, a pugilist -> dancer would make an effective party healer/enfeeblist.

Hard to explain but take a look at the guide its pretty good :]

yea, i see what you mean. But in FF14 where you can change jobs on the fly and a lot of people have everything 50 finding someone to fill the BIS role for that dungeon is pretty easy.

so in any semi serious endgame shell where speed runs are an achievable goal it will boil down to what is better time mage or bard.

[Valtrex]

This is why speed runs for the best loot are a horrible idea. WAR will always do more DMG than PLD, and still tank just as good if not better, So you bring WAR. BLM will always do more dmg than and have less risk than Melee DD. Speed runs are bad design, but the current state of events atm in FFXIV are just bad in general. If they want people to continue playing this game, they need to rework fights so that half of the jobs aren't completely useless to bring.

[darkstarpoet1]

This is why speed runs for the best loot are a horrible idea. WAR will always do more DMG than PLD, and still tank just as good if not better, So you bring WAR. BLM will always do more dmg than and have less risk than Melee DD. Speed runs are bad design, but the current state of events atm in FFXIV are just bad in general. If they want people to continue playing this game, they need to rework fights so that half of the jobs aren't completely useless to bring.

quoted for truth. it's the same thing with the adding of new jobs/classes. yes, if implemented balanced there's always room for a debuffer/trap/2 handed sword user/dot mage, but with speed runs if they are the top dps they will just replace another class in the speed run and if they are weaker they just get thrown away. they really need to make the classes more balanced and get away from the stupid speed run methods or they will never really be able to accomplish a balance.

my favorite idea i have seen is going back to the original incap that was in game and have multiple sections of a mob to incap to allow something to drop. it would be a way to get people to bring in diverse groups because it's the only way they could get all the drops. why would a main pld go into a battle for a blm burn if the only way to get the pld drop was incapping a part as a pld?

[syntaxlies]

This is why speed runs for the best loot are a horrible idea. WAR will always do more DMG than PLD, and still tank just as good if not better, So you bring WAR. BLM will always do more dmg than and have less risk than Melee DD. Speed runs are bad design, but the current state of events atm in FFXIV are just bad in general. If they want people to continue playing this game, they need to rework fights so that half of the jobs aren't completely useless to bring.

I would like to see them try a point system like hamlet on one dungeon just to see how it goes. It would allow people to score points in different ways and the speed goal could maybe be 5000 points or something. Maybe each unique class would give 500 points which could make up for not getting the speed points if it takes longer. Then for that dungeon have a merit point system or something.