Who in the developer team designed and tested the Red Mage...

[gioroggia]

... and how high were they?

I can't wrap my head around the fact that someone designed its abilities, tested the kit, and somehow decided that the thing was comparable in power/utility to the remaining jobs. I mean, really, someone looked at it and said "huh... Looks okay to me".

[Hysorn]

Probably the same one that designed WAR and was like "Yep, WAR is totally on par with the other tanks when it comes to utility".

[jrollins89]

I don't think there's anything fundamentally wrong with RDM, it's mostly just their numbers are overtuned for what the rest of their kit offers.
Similarly, I don't think there's anything wrong with WAR by itself (MAYBE a bit too much damage for a tank?), WAR is the baseline of where the other tanks should be at in terms of CC and utility imo. WAR seems strong because the other tanks are weak.

Now WHM? Yeah, that is the one that makes me scratch my head and wonder if their team playtested it. No healer should ever be brought up to that level. Just look at that monstrosity of a LB alone. Did they just run out of things to tack onto an instant cast AOE CC nuke that they had to add in all that regeneration and damage/healing amp to the fastest charging LB? Never mind the rest of their kit (yay, un-cleansable hard CC).

[gioroggia]

I don't think there's anything fundamentally wrong with RDM, it's mostly just their numbers are overtuned for what the rest of their kit offers.
Similarly, I don't think there's anything wrong with WAR by itself (MAYBE a bit too much damage for a tank?), WAR is the baseline of where the other tanks should be at in terms of CC and utility imo. WAR seems strong because the other tanks are weak.

Now WHM? Yeah, that is the one that makes me scratch my head and wonder if their team playtested it. No healer should ever be brought up to that level. Just look at that monstrosity of a LB alone. Did they just run out of things to tack onto an instant cast AOE CC nuke that they had to add in all that regeneration and damage/healing amp to the fastest charging LB? Never mind the rest of their kit (yay, un-cleansable hard CC).

I agree with you on WHM, but I believe RDM is even worse. Its damage is unmatched. It can take down any melee DPS easily - it's not even a contest. When you get rushed by one, there isn't much you can do except heal yourself nonstop, push guard, and hope the rest of the team helps you before guard is over. That if the RDM doesn't kill you in the duration of its (AOE) silence. The fact that it's damage is so high makes it very hard to outlast its burst even when you're playing defensively, which is not the case with any other job. Meanwhile, it has high mobility, high sustain when needed, AOE damage, AOE buff/debuff... Its uncanny. They fucked up.

[Wayfinder3]

I agree with you on WHM, but I believe RDM is even worse. Its damage is unmatched. It can take down any melee DPS easily - it's not even a contest. When you get rushed by one, there isn't much you can do except heal yourself nonstop, push guard, and hope the rest of the team helps you before guard is over. That if the RDM doesn't kill you in the duration of its (AOE) silence. The fact that it's damage is so high makes it very hard to outlast its burst even when you're playing defensively, which is not the case with any other job. Meanwhile, it has high mobility, high sustain when needed, AOE damage, AOE buff/debuff... Its uncanny. They fucked up.

WHM is far and away the best job in PVP. RDM is strong but no more stronger than NIN SAM DRG who all offer the same thing really. WAR and WHM however feel ridiculously omnipresent

[gioroggia]

WHM is far and away the best job in PVP. RDM is strong but no more stronger than NIN SAM DRG who all offer the same thing really. WAR and WHM however feel ridiculously omnipresent

"No more strong?". And you put Dragoon in that list? I am sorry, it is *far* better than the Dragoon and still better than NIN and SAM.

[Atreides]

"No more strong?". And you put Dragoon in that list? I am sorry, it is *far* better than the Dragoon and still better than NIN and SAM.

What?! I changed from WAR to DRG and it easily carried me further into the ranks that Job is ridiculous with the stealthy LB... who designed that shit? I never had people see it coming when used during a skirmish, not even every DRG main thinks that shit's balanced. That ridiculous LB always nets at least 1-3 kills and is up rather quick too.

[Araxes]

but I believe RDM is even worse. Its damage is unmatched.

Have you heard of your Lord and Saviour Samurai? Or maybe Dragoon?

I mean... SAM can LB THROUGH guard.

[aeoncs]

For 1v1 as a DRG, I think DRG overpowers RDM. DRG horrid roar heavily reduces RDM burst combo kit.

XD DRG can't even 1v1 3 of the 4 other melees and you're suggesting they can overpower the far and beyond strongest duelist in the game right now? 1v1s certainly isn't where the strength of DRG lies and that's perfectly fine.

People keep forgetting that Horrid Roar is de facto only 25% since Geirskogul increases your damage taken by 25%. Corps-a-corps is also a way more powerful dueling tool.

In a 1v1 scenario even with Horrid Roar active, a RDM can simply sit in White Shift and tank the 35-50k the DRG will do with their entire burst combo with 18k shields and a 10k heal and still deal 40~k damage in return. If they simply wait out Horrid Roar with Guard and Displacement, it becomes even more one-sided. Nothing can beat a RDM in a 1v1 and certainly not a DRG.

Have you heard of your Lord and Saviour Samurai? Or maybe Dragoon?

I mean... SAM can LB THROUGH guard.

A RDM can DoT you for up to 24~k through Guard every 20 seconds while a SAM can usually LB you twice per game. Their entire burst combo in Black Shift deals like 90k unmitigated without LB, this is absolutely higher than anything a DRG or SAM can do in the same amount of time.

EDIT: number adjustments

[Raistlin]

WAR is the baseline of where the other tanks should be at in terms of CC and utility imo. WAR seems strong because the other tanks are weak.

No thanks, then the game will be a permastun fiesta with Purify not working as intended is already bad when I sometimes go from 100% to 0% in stun chains after using purify.

Jobs should have ONE cc usable every 10 seconds or more.