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  1. #1
    Player
    AmiableApkallu's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2021
    Posts
    1,015
    Character
    Tatanpa Nononpa
    World
    Zalera
    Main Class
    Scholar Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by ty_taurus View Post
    I don't recall which interview it was in, but I do firmly remember someone asking the question about players who want more DPS options on Healers, and Yoshida's response was something to the respect of 'Sage is the new healer that places higher emphasis on attacking. We believe if you're looking for a more offensive healer, this job should satisfy you.'
    Isn't that in the thread I just linked to? Except with an interpretation of Yoshida's response that I think mischaracterizes what he actually said.

    Even if not, "higher emphasis" is not the same as "the job's main emphasis," and "more offensive" is not the same as "offensive." It's about relative differences.

    The current Kardia is exactly inline with a "more offensive healer" when you compare it to the other healers. It doesn't make SGE a "offensive healer", sure, but even in your recollection, that wasn't the sales pitch.
    (0)

  2. #2
    Player
    ForteNightshade's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Location
    Limsa Lominsa
    Posts
    3,613
    Character
    Kurenai Tenshi
    World
    Cactuar
    Main Class
    Paladin Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by AmiableApkallu View Post
    Let's dissect that quote though because Yoshida has some... rather awful takes.

    Yoshida: So I totally understand that those healers that have a very high player skill level and they’ve really mastered their jobs go into these different raids or battles and when they do have some downtime between their heals they do cast more offensive spells. Some of them desire to have more technical aspects of it so they are more active and I totally understand that sentiment. But of course the basis of a healer is to heal so I think the development team and I have this thinking of getting that sense of exhilaration from doing really good heal work.

    That being said I don’t think we would do any sort of dramatic addition of offensive skills moving forward. By having these offensive abilities some players, like new healers, might feel pressured like “oh do I have to have good DPS while I’m healing?” or some players might be aggressive like “oh hey you have an offensive skill in your kit, why don’t you use it?” and I don’t think that’s optimal either.

    But of course we do have the new job, Sage, which will allow for this unique gameplay where if you land an attack it heals at the same time. Or if there’s like a particular barrier ability that you cast and once that’s depleted it increases the resource which could lead to an attack which is very unique. I think players would be interested in trying that out for sure.
    Imagine if tanks and DPS could just not press their buttons and it be seen as "aggressive" to tell them otherwise. How about tanks feeling "pressured" to do DPS while mitigating incoming damage? Heaven forbid someone might have to.... now everyone may want to sit down. This is kind of shocking. You might have to... press Glare, Dia and Aero III. I know, I know, it's too much! You might even have to press another oGCD in between them! Wait, wait! What if... you had to press them 1-2-3 and they built up into a bigger hit. OH. MY. GOD. How would you ever ask someone to put that much pressure on themselves?!?!

    But wait. Doesn't that sequence of buttons sound a little familiar?

    Congratulations! I just described to you Warrior's rotation.
    (32)
    Last edited by ForteNightshade; 10-24-2022 at 09:34 AM.
    "Stand in the ashes of a trillion dead souls and ask the ghosts if honor matters."
    "The silence is your answer."


  3. #3
    Player Midareyukki's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2017
    Location
    Bozja
    Posts
    2,580
    Character
    Harun Asubra
    World
    Zodiark
    Main Class
    Warrior Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by ForteNightshade View Post
    Congratulations! I just described to you Warrior's rotation.
    Well that's just not fair, poor guys have to press Storm's Eye every now and then. So it's 1-2-4 every... what, 3-4 combos? :^) Plus the Fell Cleave spam. You're describing Dark Knight, just watered down and with less OGCDs.

    Ok but no seriously, Yoshida... <_< is he aware that he answered his own argument? "Oh, healers have figured out a way to optimize everything in a fight and want more to do between casts. Because that might make them obssess with minmaxing damage. The main purpose is to heal".

    Yeah, if healers know the main purpose is to heal, then wouldn't optimizing and being experient in healing through a fight be the first thing? They'll be focusing on damage eventually, might as well give them those tools. And if you insist that healers need to heal, then fine, design fights that don't expect healers to do damage but reward healers for doing so. In fact, you can't clear Savage without healer damage at minimum item level, right? So that's kind of the mindset they already have. Why allow something to continue being boring just because you're afraid of taking it overboard? There are ways around it, plenty of games address this with interesting skills and designs.
    (11)

  4. #4
    Player
    Somnolence's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2019
    Posts
    418
    Character
    Ixa X'phele
    World
    Zodiark
    Main Class
    Dark Knight Lv 100
    I think I already posted this in this thread some time ago, so just reminding everyone that Blue Mage can handle Omega Savage raid healing by using only 3-5 slots out of 24 for healer spells. So it still has DPS tools like Moon flute burst windows.


    Nothing in the raid design has chanced since to make this playstyle unviable.
    (7)

  5. #5
    Player MagiusNecros's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2015
    Posts
    3,205
    Character
    Bastilaa Shan
    World
    Excalibur
    Main Class
    Blue Mage Lv 80
    Quote Originally Posted by Somnolence View Post
    I think I already posted this in this thread some time ago, so just reminding everyone that Blue Mage can handle Omega Savage raid healing by using only 3-5 slots out of 24 for healer spells. So it still has DPS tools like Moon flute burst windows.


    Nothing in the raid design has chanced since to make this playstyle unviable.
    Well Blue Mage is the best job in the game and the only engaging healer to play as with good heals and a DPS kit.

    It's also prominently used to solo dungeons because BI + Healer Mimic makes Pom Cure a Benediction every cast.

    ------------------

    Low Healer damage would be fine if Healer duties involved Healing/Shielding, buffing the party, debuffing the boss/trash packs(ironically BLU is the only one that can inflict Damage Down and has a castable Silence) and preventing debuffs from occurring or applying affects that removed debuffs without the need to cast Esuna.

    Warden's Paean from Bard would be a perfect healer support skill to have.

    The way Healers are designed makes it hard to consider picking one up.
    (0)

  6. #6
    Player
    Recon1o6's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2016
    Posts
    1,296
    Character
    Avarnia Corthal
    World
    Adamantoise
    Main Class
    Dragoon Lv 90
    if sage was an actual dps healer, then at the very least it would have pneuma more frequent or on a charge system
    (0)

  7. #7
    Player
    Maltothoris's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2015
    Posts
    732
    Character
    Malto Thoris
    World
    Behemoth
    Main Class
    White Mage Lv 100
    https://www.reddit.com/r/ffxivdiscus..._october_2022/

    Now not to say it's completely accurate which it even saids so since it only accounted for people were wearing on the lodestone so in some cases the gap would be even wider but point here is that healers are imbalanced in that in an ideal setting they are much lower played than the other roles in comparison.
    (6)

  8. #8
    Player
    Rolder50's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2018
    Posts
    1,614
    Character
    Alarasong Elaha
    World
    Siren
    Main Class
    White Mage Lv 91
    Quote Originally Posted by Maltothoris View Post
    https://www.reddit.com/r/ffxivdiscus..._october_2022/

    Now not to say it's completely accurate which it even saids so since it only accounted for people were wearing on the lodestone so in some cases the gap would be even wider but point here is that healers are imbalanced in that in an ideal setting they are much lower played than the other roles in comparison.


    Can't get much more clear cut then that; healer shortage across all DCs
    (7)

  9. #9
    Player
    ASkellington's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2019
    Posts
    959
    Character
    Xynnel Valeroyant
    World
    Balmung
    Main Class
    Astrologian Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Rolder50 View Post


    Can't get much more clear cut then that; healer shortage across all DCs
    They said "if you don't like the role, leave".

    Here's what it looks like when we leave. Shocker.
    (12)
    I'm tired of being told to wait for post-patches and expansions for fixes and increased healing requirements that are never coming. Healers are not fun in all forms of content like all jobs should be, they're replaced by tanks and dps due to low healing requirements and their dps kit is small for 0 reason, when in the past we had more options and handled things just fine. I refuse to play healer in roulette come DT. I refuse to heal EXs, I refuse to go into Savage, and I am boycotting Ultimate.

    #FFXIVHEALERSTRIKE

  10. #10
    Player
    Sunhwapark's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2017
    Posts
    350
    Character
    Dear Boy
    World
    Ragnarok
    Main Class
    Fisher Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by ASkellington View Post
    They said "if you don't like the role, leave".

    Here's what it looks like when we leave. Shocker.
    I'm sure they'll just blame the low participation on something else, it never stopped them before.
    (18)

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