Healers need an overhaul

[HyoMinPark]

Well we disagree on that. And some of the other replies indisputably are personal attacks.

The first response you relied to wasn’t a personal attack. It was merely a statement of fact that wasn’t even directed at you.

Mine, for how I've been playing the game since 2015.

How convenient. I, too, started playing this game in late 2015. So now which one of us is more important? Do you see how you cannot base whose feedback is the most meaningful around playtime? Just because someone has been playing for longer doesn’t mean their feedback with regards to any topic is more important.

I don't know what the "hardcore" players need: I don't have their perspective, and I'll do them the courtesy of not pretending I do. It would be nice if they returned that favor.

This could be turned right back against you. Keep that in mind. It would be nice if a lot of the people on here that argue with healer mains that want something to change would take a step back and really consider why the former group is asking for change in the first place.

It’s not as if all hardcore players don’t do casual content or don’t remember what it was like before they started raiding. “Hardcore” healers asking for more engagement—be it via more healing needed or variety in a damage rotation—are unlikely to affect those playing at a casual level.

I don’t know if you are aware, but even our “hardcore” content suffers from lack of healer engagement. I spend 80% or more of my time casting Dosis III. I have usually anywhere from 100 to 150 or more casts of it depending on the fight kill time. I don’t heal with GCDs. I can basically autopilot. It’s incredibly boring, and it’s disheartening that even tough content cannot be engaging for healers.

Maybe you need to pug more. There's nothing monotonous about running with tanks and/or DPS who don't know their kit, don't know the mechanics, or both. I don't even find it frustrating, because I don't have high expectations for pugging, and certainly don't expect a fast clear.

I really dislike this argument. Why do healers have to go out of their way to find fun and engagement in their role? Do DPS have to do this? What about tanks? Why are healers the only one that get to be bored? Why are healers the only ones who need to go find clown fiesta parties to have fun? Is there a reason we can’t just have fun and be engaged all the time?

[MisterNublet]

Maybe you need to pug more. There's nothing monotonous about running with tanks and/or DPS who don't know their kit, don't know the mechanics, or both. I don't even find it frustrating, because I don't have high expectations for pugging, and certainly don't expect a fast clear.

What a god awful take. There is absolutely an issue with the job design if the only way to have fun with the job is to seek out subpar players.

[Silverbane]

I wrote:
There's nothing monotonous about running with tanks and/or DPS who don't know their kit, don't know the mechanics, or both. I don't even find it frustrating, because I don't have high expectations for pugging, and certainly don't expect a fast clear.

I really dislike this argument. Why do healers have to go out of their way to find fun and engagement in their role?

Go out of my way? You mean, by doing duty roulettes?

As in all of life, you can either find a way to enjoy what the game offers you, or not.
Totally up to you.

[Silverbane]

What a god awful take. There is absolutely an issue with the job design if the only way to have fun with the job is to seek out subpar players.

Who said it was the only way? And although it seems odd to have to tell someone with such a strong opinion on healing this, no one (i.e., not tanks or DPS either) needs to "seek out subpar players." Just run duty roulettes, and you can't avoid them.

Do try to remember, though, that just about everyone was a sub par players at some point.

[Silverbane]

It’s not as if all hardcore players don’t do casual content or don’t remember what it was like before they started raiding. “Hardcore” healers asking for more engagement—be it via more healing needed or variety in a damage rotation—are unlikely to affect those playing at a casual level.

In a world where FFXIV had infinite development resources to allocate, that might be true. But we don't live in that world.
Every change consumes development budget. So every change comes at a cost: other changes not made, less and/or lower quality content being developed, and so on.

But feel free to keep asking for the change you want.
I'm saying, quite simply, that I don't want what you want, and by implication would rather SE directed their efforts elsewhere.
Like to more quality content, for example, I never don't want that.

I have no expectation that I will convince the "healers need an overhaul" contingent to agree with me.
I just want SE to hear that yes, some people like what they've done with healers (especially with SGE).
It's regrettable if people on this thread can't tolerate seeing that put in print, but it's still true.

[HyoMinPark]

I wrote:

There's nothing monotonous about running with tanks and/or DPS who don't know their kit, don't know the mechanics, or both. I don't even find it frustrating, because I don't have high expectations for pugging, and certainly don't expect a fast clear.

Go out of my way? You mean, by doing duty roulettes?

Yes. You do have to go out of your way. The average duty roulette is just that: average. People aren’t dying left and right; I can keep the tank alive with oGCDs if they somehow forget about their self-mitigations and heals. DPS may eat an AOE or two, but nothing my oGCD toolkit won’t solve. I don’t really have to lift much of a finger in the average duty finder run.

What I do have to do is find true meme parties to feel engaged on healer. It’s the main reason why I always heal 24-mans on the day they release: people are going to eat stuff, people are going to die, and I will actually have to go into damage control. I finally get to be an actual healer, and not just a gimped damage dealer. Because that’s what healers are at this point: gimped damage dealers. We certainly aren’t healers. Content is being done without us—that’s how “valuable” we are.

I spam old 24-mans—specifically Dun Scaith and Orbonne Monastery and sometimes the NieR raids—just to get that one party that is a complete mess. The main way for a healer to remain engaged is to basically go out of their way and find groups like that. In any average group, you are pressing one button the majority of the time: be it your AOE or your single-target nuke. And you are doing little to no thought while doing so.

As in all of life, you can either find a way to enjoy what the game offers you, or not.
Totally up to you.

Or…the developers could make healing at all levels engaging. Be it by giving us more to heal, or by giving us an actual rotation or something else to do other than spam Glare/Malefic/Broil/Dosis until our keybind breaks. That sounds like a much better alternative instead of what you suggested: telling us to go find parties that are basically a mess.

Or, you know, instead of the developers themselves telling us to go do Ultimate. I’ve healed Ultimates. They don’t require nearly the amount of healing you would think a fight with the tag “ultimate” would require. And if the hardest fights in the game require so little healing compared to the amount of damage abilities I’m using, then how do you think normal content is?

In a world where FFXIV had infinite development resources to allocate, that might be true. But we don't live in that world.
Every change consumes development budget. So every change comes at a cost: other changes not made, less and/or lower quality content being developed, and so on.

But feel free to keep asking for the change you want.
I'm saying, quite simply, that I don't want what you want, and by implication would rather SE directed their efforts elsewhere.
Like to more quality content, for example, I never don't want that.

I have no expectation that I will convince the "healers need an overhaul" contingent to agree with me.
I just want SE to hear that yes, some people like what they've done with healers (especially with SGE).
It's regrettable if people on this thread can't tolerate seeing that put in print, but it's still true.

Healers have been asking for changes for years. Since late Stormblood/Shadowbringers release. It’s sad that people would rather see us silenced because “it’s fine the way it is because I said so” versus actually considering what those asking for change are saying.

[MisterNublet]

Who said it was the only way? And although it seems odd to have to tell someone with such a strong opinion on healing this, no one (i.e., not tanks or DPS either) needs to "seek out subpar players." Just run duty roulettes, and you can't avoid them.

Do try to remember, though, that just about everyone was a sub par players at some point.

I stopped running duty roulettes over a month ago. What now? Do I put "bad players only" in the description of my party finder savage groups? Obviously not. That would be stupid.

Not a single person should have to subject oneself to poor play by other players just to enjoy their chosen job. It is the job of the developers to make sure the core gameplay is enjoyable at all levels and facets of the game whether its causal or hardcore, and if they're unable to or unwilling to then they're in the wrong career.

[Silverbane]

What I do have to do is find true meme parties ... people are going to eat stuff, people are going to die, and I will actually have to go into damage control. I finally get to be an actual healer.

Ah, see, I don't care if I run "an actual healer," whatever that means.
I run a FFXIV Sage, I enjoy running an FFXIV Sage, and whether that means I'm running "an actual healer" is irrelevant. All that matters is that, for me, it's more fun than, say, running an FFXIV Dancer or FFXIV Warrior (both of which are OK, BTW, but I enjoy Sage more.).

If I read you right, and apologies if I haven't, you set your heart on running "an actual healer," whatever that means, and then subscribed to a game that does not offer that option. Now you want the game to change to suit you. I don't think you're entitled to that, and I don't think SE is going to do that, but feel free to keep asking. Damn shame if that's making you unhappy, though, because it's your choices that created the situation.

[Nethereal]

That said, I personally have never said anything about opposing change, I simply stated that I'm enjoying healing as it is now. I'm not opposed to change per se. .

I'm not sure why you're including this, my post wasn't about you? I would've quoted you.

It's not illegal to enjoy the current state of healers.

[HyoMinPark]

Ah, see, I don't care if I run "an actual healer," whatever that means.
I run a FFXIV Sage, I enjoy running an FFXIV Sage, and whether that means I'm running "an actual healer" is irrelevant. All that matters is that, for me, it's more fun than, say, running an FFXIV Dancer or FFXIV Warrior (both of which are OK, BTW, but I enjoy Sage more.).

I also main SGE. I am dealing damage more than I am healing. And it still doesn’t change the fact that my damage rotation is boring.

If I read you right, and apologies if I haven't, you set your heart on running "an actual healer," whatever that means, and then subscribed to a game that does not offer that option. Now you want the game to change to suit you. I don't think you're entitled to that, and I don't think SE is going to do that, but feel free to keep asking. Damn shame if that's making you unhappy, though, because it's your choices that created the situation.

I wasn’t aware that I told the developers to make me more of a damage dealer than a healer. Or to give me one button to spam ad nauseam.