Rescue Needs to GO

[Grimoire-M]

None of these mechanic punish the group for one player failing them. If the players fail them then they fail them and learn for the next time.
I don't know if you're purposely misunderstanding me or not but savage mechanics punish the whole group for failing them, normal mode mechanics do not and a player being out of position just impacts them. It's not a big deal if they were to die from a mistake.

Besides, we're talking about having a toggle that most people won't touch. It's not that big of a deal to just give players that power to curate their experience in the game.

You're assuming mistakes happen in isolation. I'm assuming they're not. It's that simple.

EDIT: To be clear, the people arguing against you understand two very basic healer concepts. Triage, and Resource Management. We are using Rescue to conserve raise mana and to avoid hardcast raise in the first place. Meaning it's being used in a context where players ARE making enough mistakes to warrant it. Also, it's factually a DPS gain over raise. Not only from the GCDs the DPS lost in the interim AND the weakness penalty, but the GCDs the healer has to use if they're required to hardcast Raise. It's a better tool than Swiftcast if you know what you're doing. And we do. You don't. You wanna be greedy, guess what, sometimes we are too. And it's more satisfying to execute than any DPS rotation in this game, and I play fucking Ninja.

[VerdeLuck]

You're assuming mistakes happen in isolation. I'm assuming they're not. It's that simple.

EDIT: To be clear, the people arguing against you understand two very basic healer concepts. Triage, and Resource Management. We are using Rescue to conserve raise mana and to avoid hardcast raise in the first place. Meaning it's being used in a context where players ARE making enough mistakes to warrant it. Also, it's factually a DPS gain over raise. Not only from the GCDs the DPS lost in the interim AND the weakness penalty, but the GCDs the healer has to use if they're required to hardcast Raise. It's a better tool than Swiftcast if you know what you're doing. And we do. You don't. You wanna be greedy, guess what, sometimes we are too. And it's more satisfying to execute than any DPS rotation in this game, and I play fucking Ninja.

Why are you so concerned with DPS gain and having a not wasting GCDs in normal mode content? There are absolutely no DPS checks in normal mode content that would warrant that level of optimization. You're just manufacturing a mountain out of a molehill because you want to die on the hill for your right to tell people what they should do. It's not your place to do it and SE has said as much in their TOS under the section about compelling a playstyle. You can't control other people in an online game. Stop trying to micromanage and talk down to people like they're 3 year olds and just play the game. If someone dies and they need to wait on swiftcast for a raise ok then they have to do it. It's casual content, it's designed around this stuff.
A toggle would be a perfect solution to this problem, other games already have it, there's no terrible apocalypse that happened because players could turn it off when they didn't want other people using skills that can move them around. If you want to use it for mechanics or enforce it in a Party Finder for Extremes and Savages where DPS actually matters then go ahead, they can enable it being used on them again. It just saves a whole lot of headaches, arguments, and GM tickets in casual content and roulettes to pre-empt it and let the player say no thanks before it's even used on them.

[Semirhage]

I want a toggle that allows me to turn off other players' ability to run AOEs into me. Those AOEs could kill me, and that would be controlling my character which is offensive to me.

[Grimoire-M]

I want a toggle that allows me to turn off other players' ability to run AOEs into me. Those AOEs could kill me, and that would be controlling my character which is offensive to me.

See, Verde? Semi is using sarcasm to highlight the irony of your own statement. Because they understand that I used the same argument another player used to justify not being rescued in the first place that I already refuted in this same thread, underneath the argument you still don’t have a sufficient answer to. Good healers use rescue because it’s free, helps the party, and conserves important resources necessary for covering mistakes, Like every other healer cooldown. A healer using it is doing their job better than one who doesn’t, even if you don’t like it.

[ASkellington]

It absolutely can have an opt out, if everyone would opt out of being moved by a random healer if it were offered, doesn't that say something about the skill? That it's really not needed or fun except for the person who's using it?

This falls apart in two situations:

1. The person in question opting out. I Rescue them because they're greeding and I have a better sense of timing than they do. They take unnecessary damage that could have been avoided.
2. The new person to a dungeon opts out and thus I cannot Rescue them out of the bad and again takes unnecessary damage.

THE WHOLE POINT OF THE HEALING ROLE IS TO PREVENT AND HEAL DAMAGE. Why would you remove a skill that aids us in doing so?

It's not fun to have control taken away from you, especially when it's taken away by another player and the decision is made entirely by someone else with no input by yourself.

Hello to my problem with stack markers when I have people running away from me. What? Are we going to remove them too? Or MAYBE I can use RESCUE to move them TO ME.

If you were to have a toggle it would still let you use it in premade groups if you wanted to for that value, that would still be there. You just wouldn't be able to decide and micromanage where other people can stand.

If it were made a toggle as we've said REPEATEDLY it makes Rescue a dead skill like Repose. NO.

And it's not like it even matters if someone messes up and dies, that's part of the game, that's how you learn to play. Besides the fact that everyone stands in mechanics and dies a few times learning, nothing in the game outside of Extreme and Savage content actually punishes the entire group for one player failing, all it does is kill the player who failed the mechanic. the level of micromanaging and trying to boss other players around just seems entirely unneeded. Let them play their own characters man, you don't have to be a control freak and make them do exactly what you want.

The same can be said of Rescue. I mess up the timing of Rescue to save you and you die. Oh well. I tried to do my job.

[Shuuli]

The idea that you should have ANY control over another persons character needs to go away. There should be a way for us to turn it off so that healers can not pull us at any point. We should know the dungeon well enough or know enough to get out of the way. But (and I know what they will say "I pulled you to save you from the AOE") No...You pulled me to my death, you interrupted my series of abilities, you turned the creature right towards the party and most of all....brought the aggro.....right towards everyone. So do us all a favor. And for those of you that are using rescue as a "get even" tool. It is a highly reportable offense and people's accounts have been suspended over it. Remember. If you can pull a character than why can't tanks turn off stance.

You can turn it off, by clicking anti knockback it works on it.

The only times I have seen this ability used in a "mean" manner is when I am with friends and they wanna pull me, but I know and just pull an antiKB.

In any other situation it was always useful and used by healers to help.

Your situation sounds like perhaps the person did not understand the tanking aspect. Maybe they are never tanking or not tanking that much. You can stop and explain to them that what they did caused xyz... how you summed it up, sounds like that they tried to help, therefore it is not reportable, as they had no malicious intentions.

It is very hard to judge the situation when we dont know what type of content you were running and what type of conversations went down in the party.

[Vencio]

I don’t use it nor I care,

Not my job to rescue anyone from not following through group or mechanics sorts,

Better yet, remove it (Less abilities, the better),

I don’t look; I simply focus on healing & maintaining consistency, but anyone not following they died; I don’t look

PS: That’s why rez exists; it’s the best & obligation I have to follow

[Shuuli]

None of these mechanic punish the group for one player failing them. If the players fail them then they fail them and learn for the next time.
I don't know if you're purposely misunderstanding me or not but savage mechanics punish the whole group for failing them, normal mode mechanics do not and a player being out of position just impacts them. It's not a big deal if they were to die from a mistake.

Besides, we're talking about having a toggle that most people won't touch. It's not that big of a deal to just give players that power to curate their experience in the game.

Very easy example for you on how failing a mechanic can punish the party: New EW Ex trial 3. If your people stack up vuln stacks due the planets, or because they fail to stand in the meteors (the full party will gain vuln stack based on how many people f up) then comes the big Raid wide and wipes half the team and gives a deadly bleed to the rest that may be still alive. I cannot tell you how many times I died on bleed because the healer needed to focus to keep the tank alive and they choose them over me... a sad feeling when I did all of my mechs perfectly and the 2 melee messed up all of theirs for greed.

I have seen people use rescue here in a very good and useful way and I would not like it to be removed.

[Espon]

I've saved plenty of people with Rescue and even prevented wipes with it.

In my entire time playing the game I've only been killed by rescue once, and that was because the healer thought I was standing in a bad place and their Rescue pulled me through the AoE as it triggered. They apologized and I didn't hold it against them or come to the forums and demand that it be removed.

I don't think a toggle would be a good idea as I don't want to be mashing the button wondering why nothing is happening and the person dies due to standing in the wrong place and having Rescue turned off. Plus now you got the issue of healers complaining they could of prevented your death if you didn't disable the toggle.

I don’t use it nor I care,

Not my job to rescue anyone from not following through group or mechanics sorts,

Better yet, remove it (Less abilities, the better),

I don’t look; I simply focus on healing & maintaining consistency, but anyone not following they died; I don’t look

PS: That’s why rez exists; it’s the best & obligation I have to follow

Why should I waste my Swiftcast and 2400 MP when I could of just as easily used Rescue?

Better yet, why even heal someone that got hit by an avoidable mechanic? I could just resurrect them later. Not my job to heal anyone from not following through group or mechanics sorts.

[Mapleine]

Why are you so concerned with DPS gain and having a not wasting GCDs in normal mode content? There are absolutely no DPS checks in normal mode content that would warrant that level of optimization. You're just manufacturing a mountain out of a molehill because you want to die on the hill for your right to tell people what they should do. It's not your place to do it and SE has said as much in their TOS under the section about compelling a playstyle. You can't control other people in an online game. Stop trying to micromanage and talk down to people like they're 3 year olds and just play the game. If someone dies and they need to wait on swiftcast for a raise ok then they have to do it. It's casual content, it's designed around this stuff.
A toggle would be a perfect solution to this problem, other games already have it, there's no terrible apocalypse that happened because players could turn it off when they didn't want other people using skills that can move them around. If you want to use it for mechanics or enforce it in a Party Finder for Extremes and Savages where DPS actually matters then go ahead, they can enable it being used on them again. It just saves a whole lot of headaches, arguments, and GM tickets in casual content and roulettes to pre-empt it and let the player say no thanks before it's even used on them.

Full on cringepost.