Multiplayer trust system

[Luluna]

I really would love this. As people have said it is great if you duo or trio. I have asked for this in the past and will support it ^O^

[elioaiko]

I think this would help with filling in members in a party d/c or leaves for any reason.

Ik that sometimes during the late night, it's hard to fit healer or tank. This would help fill until someone joins or even finish the run.

I too have a friend who isn't good in groups so it's hard to convince to do dungeons together.

[Kemiko]

I think - at least in part - the issue they run into with multiple players the system is when you're leveling them up. Who's avatars do you use in a 2-man group or a 3-man group. Do those avatars all gain experience for the players involved? What happens if one of the players avatars aren't a high enough level for the dungeon - can they just not join or will their avatars not get experience?

[DezereDawn]

I think - at least in part - the issue they run into with multiple players the system is when you're leveling them up. Who's avatars do you use in a 2-man group or a 3-man group. Do those avatars all gain experience for the players involved? What happens if one of the players avatars aren't a high enough level for the dungeon - can they just not join or will their avatars not get experience?

Host's avatars, since this would obviously be more of a "party with a friend and run a trust otherwise" system

[GeminiReed]

I think - at least in part - the issue they run into with multiple players the system is when you're leveling them up. Who's avatars do you use in a 2-man group or a 3-man group. Do those avatars all gain experience for the players involved? What happens if one of the players avatars aren't a high enough level for the dungeon - can they just not join or will their avatars not get experience?

I haven't yet used the Duty Support system for anything that also covered by the Trust so take this with a grain of salt: The D/S avatars don't need to be leveled or gain levels. I consider that a huge QoL feature.

Part of the reason why I don't use the Trust outside of 1st runs is that I haven't leveled mine. I tried once and burned out on the 2nd or 3rd run of Dohn Mheg. That was after the first but not the current xp buff they got. Even with the current system I'd need to level mine from the low 70's and that's just not going to happen. At least not on my main.

[JTWrenn]

I think - at least in part - the issue they run into with multiple players the system is when you're leveling them up. Who's avatars do you use in a 2-man group or a 3-man group. Do those avatars all gain experience for the players involved? What happens if one of the players avatars aren't a high enough level for the dungeon - can they just not join or will their avatars not get experience?

Leaders avatars as they control them, and they down level to match, and gain experience for the dungeon the same as they normally would. So running dungeons over and over with the same members you would swap or just use whoever needs to level.

[JTWrenn]

I think - at least in part - the issue they run into with multiple players the system is when you're leveling them up. Who's avatars do you use in a 2-man group or a 3-man group. Do those avatars all gain experience for the players involved? What happens if one of the players avatars aren't a high enough level for the dungeon - can they just not join or will their avatars not get experience?

Leaders avatars as they control them, and they down level to match, and gain experience for the dungeon the same as they normally would. So running dungeons over and over with the same members you would swap or just use whoever needs to level. There are a lot of options on how to solve this. Could even give exp to both players characters, or split it or something like that. Just a decision.

[Azuri]

Yoshida has adressed this request in one of the recent Live Letters. TLDR: Designing AI to interact with one player is fine, designing AI to interact with multiple players is not. They have no plans to invest into such system.

[-BlueGreen-]

Yoshida has addressed this request in one of the recent Live Letters. TLDR: Designing AI to interact with one player is fine, designing AI to interact with multiple players is not. They have no plans to invest into such system.

Then we should convince them to change plans! Remember how they weren't going to invest in allowing us to fly in ARR areas and they gave us the ability to increase our ground mount speed at first? We shouldn't give up.

I've seen some mention of avatar experience/leveling, but I think it's fine if avatar mode is strictly single player. I know leveling avatars and meeting level requirements was a pain with the trust system at first, but since then they've added the ability to use either the avatars system or re-run the dungeon in scenario mode where you can use the NPCs that were available at that point in the MSQ. This new duty support system doesn't have an NPC leveling component to it, so there's no concern there.

It doesn't seem like there's much to adjust:

• As long as duty support NPCs or scenario-mode trust NPCs are used, there's no level/exp concerns.
• It doesn't really matter who the NPCs follow, just make them follow the same human player.
• NPCs already run on a "player adjust to them" basis. They have preset locations for stack/spread mechanics and when there's something that needs to be intercepted (pillar/tether marker), the NPCs already spread out between themselves and expect the player to find one of the ones that aren't covered.
• NPCs can already function when down one or two NPCs. Run as a healer and let DPS die or as tank and let the healer/DPS die. The fights continue just fine even if you don't bother (or can't) raise them.

The only other thing that might be problematic is the current rule of "if the player dies, it's a wipe". It might be tricky for them to change this so that it only applies if all human players are down at the same time. The alternative is just to make normal wipe rules apply to allow trust healers to raise players. Of course, if a team of NPCs can carry a solo player through every dungeon no matter how many times the healer has to raise you, that might make dungeons "too easy".

Granted, if SE didn't want the game to be "too easy", the "very easy" mode of instanced battles wouldn't have been added. I don't care if someone else is running trust dungeons solo and letting NPCs carry them through the MSQ. They're helping to pay the dev/server costs with their subscription all the same.