Future Machinist Rework

[MikoRemi]

@Shurrikhan
I suppose I would have to see it in action but it certainly sounds like it makes things a bit complicated but maybe it'd make sense if I saw it normally. It does sound like needing to remember multiple rotations for single targeting alone however so it does make it a bit much.

It does sound like Rook though is the least useful of the turrets at least from what I'm seeing as Bishop would just become a more powerful Wildfire which is concerning. I know procs are something that are more reserved for Dancer and Bard though as Machinist being more consistent would keep it stable, the days of Reload catridges made for some frustrations even with them being around often so having them present again isn't quite the route to go.

I do like the idea of the MP bar being used, but at that point the Battery gauge is just there. I personally prefer the idea of "Aetherial Catridges" where you use MP to boost your base GCD's so that it's a nice buff for a time but still gives some time to recharge since we don't have a way to regain MP all that swiftly, but I mostly shelved that idea.

I don't necessarily want to discount the turret changes but it's a bit uncomfortable of an idea with having to learn macrorotations for a job that while being the most difficult of the Physical Ranged, is not trying to go too heavy with difficulty and also trying NOT to exceed Black Mage's damage. I want to aim for slightly above Reaper to keep it fair and also keep the difficulty in the mid range, if anything needed to up in difficulty to be around BLM damage, it should be BLM itself or Samurai. Flamethrower being fixed is part of my document so there's that as well. As for the Physical Ranged tax, Blast Charge makes up for that as is but I don't want to discount the rest of the kit to just be a glorified melee. It's a bit of a worrisome path with this sort of rework in my opinion.

The idea of the new "Wildfire" effect scaling off of weaponskill potency is also a bit much, I mostly want to keep that in the PVP route where anything can trigger it and it will do damage. At most, the finisher should be able to be affected by raid buffs and such. Not to discount the idea entirely as it would certainly boost the damage but potentially limit some freedoms with having to save everything for that big burst, it gives me a bit of the Stormblood flashbacks. If anything that particular post just sounds like bringing back Stormblood Machinist...which as much as I like Stormblood, that Machinist rotation was definitely not desirable.

[Shurrikhan]

It does sound like Rook though is the least useful of the turrets at least from what I'm seeing as Bishop would just become a more powerful Wildfire which is concerning.

In the example given above, it'd have access to, as one of its two skills (or as its Overload), Wildfire, but as implied by the latter's "refreshing," it'd be a CD still. You wouldn't just stay in Wildfire, and therefore Bishop, forever. You'd just force a bit of forethought/preemptive action, as you'd want to be done with Rook by the time Bishop came up.

I know procs are something that are more reserved for Dancer and Bard though as Machinist being more consistent would keep it stable, the days of Reload cartridges made for some frustrations even with them being around often so having them present again isn't quite the route to go.

Okay, so we need to back up a bit. MCH was, from its conception, THE proc job. Each skill in the combo (previously not a combo) had a 50% chance to unlock the next. And I fully disagree that just because a few people couldn't handle ammo that the gameplay would be inferior to the mindless 1-2-3 (or, for any plugin player, 1-1-1) spam we have now.

a job that while being the most difficult of the Physical Ranged

Oh, damn. Wow. That's a good one. Well played. Get me a second to clean my drink off my desk.

The idea of the new "Wildfire" effect scaling off of weaponskill potency is also a bit much

That's not a new idea. By the end of the duration, that'll have acted like literally any other standard damage buff (save that this one would affect only GCD damage). And it's the way Wildfire worked for half its lifetime.

it gives me a bit of the Stormblood flashbacks

Honestly... fine. That'd be preferable to the current direction of MCH. (Though, I don't see how a Wildfire that affected only by weaponskills would force nearly as much in-window rush or finnickyness as Stormblood's version.)

[MikoRemi]

@Shurrikhan
I suppose so, it still seems like quite the turret though even then.

I'm aware of how it was in Stormblood, the idea though is Bard has the procs through songs and Dancer has the chance of unlocking the rest. Having Machinist be the more static one is fine, albeit needing to be careful not to get fully back to the clunkiness of the full Stormblood rotation. I never really mentioned ammo being the thing that made it inferior although it was just part of the whole.

The sarcasm truly helps me get into your post more, very much so. I would be more inclined to listen without it. However yes, Machinist being the harder of the Physical Ranged isn't hyperbole, Bard isn't all that difficult even in the olden times with song management, and Dancer needs no explanation.

The thing is it essentially forces you to save everything for that one duration, and having any miss in that window whether something jumps away or happens to die is simply disheartening. Just because that's how it worked for half the lifetime doesn't always mean it has to go back there. All we need now is for the general potency to go much much higher overall, but still apply the same potency regardless, which again the PVP method is a good showcase on having a nice burst. If they happened to give it the weaponskill boost, it has the potential to mess with the freedom of the proposed rework.

The current direction of Machinist isn't ideal because it's the extreme of being overly simple while not meeting where it should be. I remember doing that old opener and rotation back in the day though and it was very much painful. Yes, I could do it consistently, but if it wasn't the damage being sad even then, it was also painful whenever even one thing happened to deviate, which is a common thing in any fight. My direction is to keep the class mostly freeform but have the player needing to think twice when using their filler move, and giving back some of the lost utility.