I'm sorry, but is Warrior completely broken in Crystal Conflict right now?

[AnotherPerson]

The actual truth is that Warrior is not broken. They're actually quite average if you know how to play against them. They're only broken if you play up to their strengths and multiple people end up aggroing the "Tank" in close proximity, allowing the tank to stun multiple targets for their allies and heal up easily. If the tank can't get aggro... what are they going to hit to heal? If they can't hit multiple targets, what kind of stun effects can they dish out that other jobs with CC can't do?

If you're having big issues against a WAR, it's because you either have no clue what they do, or because you have no clue what you're doing wrong. ... Which can be said for a lot of people playing PvP until they familiarize themselves with all the other jobs actually, myself included. Until I played WAR to figure out exactly what makes them strong and what debilitates them so badly, I also thought they were quite strong, but now I know otherwise. The reality is just that other players take advantage of WAR's ability to "seemingly never able to die" because they know how to play WAR and capitalize on its strengths best.

It may have a low skill floor starting out, but the higher rank you go in Crystalline Conflict, the less likely people will give a WAR that advantage because there are many ways to shut them down if they blindly go unga bunga. It has a pretty high skill ceiling imo.

Remember, if you think a job is very strong in PvP, it's probably not because it's very strong. Rather, it's just the player that is very good at their job in the rank you're playing at. Ranged DPS like Bard and Dancer is included here, but their effects is harder to see unless the team knows what to do. The difference for some jobs is that the more reliant your support is to a team, the more multiplicative the effects that support can do. Same goes with ninja - it's strong if your team can coordinate with it well, but have a completely useless limit break if your team can't get anyone low enough in a coordinated fight until it's too late. However, ninja also rely on themselves if they want to duel an enemy, so it's not the same as completely reliant on the team like BRD or DNC. Many people find WHM easy and strong because their support is very straightforward. It has CC, healing, and damage. Very simple and to the point, and feels strong overall. WHM is very beginner-friendly in how it plays, just like WAR.

In contrast, people look at PvP SCH and would think that SCH is a lot weaker in retrospect due to less healing and less damage they can output. However, in the hands of a good team, a SCH can be many times stronger than a WHM due to its widespread control over debuffing enemies and weakening their damage output significantly. The key difference between the two jobs is how to utilize their toolkit to give a multiplicative result.

[Cheremia]

yes

And if you see a WAR that got many kills? They simply were super good at picking low hp targets. Or just got the lucky last hit.

Dunno what people mean with stunlock? 15 seconds is hardly what i call stunlock at all.
I have never been stunlocked by a war?
How are they supposed to, they alone can‘t.
Don‘t mistake people focusing you down with multiple stuns as them doing it.

There are some overtuned things, sure. But feeding wars with everybody in the same area and then calling it op is another thing entirely. Thats your fault, not theirs to only be good in cuddling-scenarios and people giving them to them.
Aoe is what they are good at. Aoe is what everybody gives them.

Once people realize to not cuddle and actually kill the warrior as a team, they cant do anything.

[Yeul]

Its not broken, is good but thats it. Just CC them and u are good.

[Atreides]

People are so scared of WARs in PvP that they try to shut it down which is basicly exactly what a WAR wants he essentially has full aggro if people do that and can do what he can do best. Survive for long enough for the team to pick the opponents appart. That is if your team is not made of imbeciles that try to figure out how their keyboard works...

[Kaoru_Nagisa]

People are so scared of WARs in PvP that they try to shut it down which is basicly exactly what a WAR wants he essentially has full aggro if people do that and can do what he can do best.

Yep. They work best in a crowd of people.

I finally stepped into CC last night after finishing most of the other patch content up, and I went in on WAR first just to see how it is. I mostly unga bunga my way over the finish line, but once you get used to the kit, you realize exactly what sort of role you have. I pulled the crystal to victory a number of times just by being such a dang thorn in the enemy team's side that they all had to focus on me to even manage to kill me - which, in turn, let the rest of my team push the crystal with less hassle.

Sitting on it like some sort of bodyguard and picking off the enemy team as they all one-by-one rush back into the fray is funny, too.

Machinists are definitely a WAR's bane, though. NIN + MCH pairs absolutely destroy me without fail, I'm usually stunlocked long enough to get deleted. So they certainly aren't invincible gods, just something people need to know how to shut down. Which is true of all classes in PvP, really.

[Hyrist]

I see the back and forth but I want to sort of put this in a better perspective.

Warrior is the Opposite of Dragoon.

A Dragoon has no CC.
Has incredible burst damage potential.
Has no Defense Shredding.
Can be Defensive if needed.
Great at disengaging when needed.

Warrior however:
Has Incredible CC.
Has little damage up front.
Has Defense Shredding (LB disables Guard)
Can Push for Damage as needed.
Has little disengage, but great engage.


They're the polar opposites of one another.

The difference in value is that CC enables OTHER damage dealers to get their full damage in - therefore a Warrior seems like they're this unstoppable force that's broken. Vs Dragoon, that you can get amazing highlight reels out of but any experienced dragoon can tell you - there's some pretty large pitfalls for the class when exploited.

I do think 15 seconds is a bit too small of a cooldown on their aoe stun engage (Primal Rend) but they're not inherently broken. They're literally just the best engage class which makes it feels the most powerful. If people learn how to spread out a little and play their optimal ranges a bit better, warrior's influence on the field becomes far less. Pushing the crystal does not necessitate 5 people clustered in a small area waiting to be crushed by chain AoEs.

[Colt47]

It's not warrior that is broken, it's just stun in general. Even in CC there are groups that just know how to do a coordinated stun lock if they get the right setup and use it instantly. From what I've seen in CC there's no counter to it as breaking the stun results in getting hit by the second stun, and at that point you're taking so much damage that you fall over. Also it's advantageous in CC since people tend to do this weaving in and out of the group, and the idea is to stagger the kills so stunlocking two people and insta gibbing them is almost always going to push the match in the stunning teams favor.

There should always be a counter to an ability in someones kit and the designers did adhere to it, just they didn't account for usage. I would probably have avoided hard stuns and just made them soft stuns so people can still use escape or defense cooldowns when it happens. That way there is counter play to it rather than it just being a one shot.

[Absimiliard]

I'd say WAR is fine as it is. We have numerous counter-play options at our disposal when it comes to dealing with them.

Besides, this gives them something to do while they keep the bench warm and await the day they are welcome in raids again.

[Barachim]

Alright, I've reached the point where I am 110% done with the Warrior. Something needs to be done about this stun gap closer, because right now it feels like a officially sanctioned cheat move by Square. What damn black magic fudgery let's the Warrior stop me in my tracks for a free hit? The Warrior basically goes "ZA WARUDO!!!", I'm frozen in time and then the Warrior just comes flying at me.

[Cheremia]

"ZA WARUDO!!!"[/I], I'm frozen in time and then the Warrior just comes flying at me.

Whats actually happening:
WAR targets you
WAR hits Primal Rend
You get stunned
1 Second already gone
WAR comes flying at you
Next second already gone
You are ready to move
WAR is still in its animation for a short period after crashing down

I don't think people realize that Primal rends animation is SO long that the Warrior itself BARELY gets ANYTHING out of their own stun. Some people just keep standing around. Since it is in fact only a 2 second stun and the stun is before the Warrior even hits you, so it has 1 second to move to you and guess what takes a second to reach you.

If you cant move after the Warrior landed, it's somebody else that stunned you after.
If you didnt move away by then, you probably get hit by Orogeny or even funnier because then you REALLY didn't move, Chaotic Cyclone.

A warrior single Rending you means you do not have to waste a purify. Since they can't do much with it in the middle of nowhere with no support, just run away. Or ignore them for a bit, they can't do much to you

Funnily enough, the only time i got stunlocked and killed was by monks. Single handedly stunned me, then stunned me again with purify effect not working on it and then proceeded to kill me. Multiple times in a match with no counterplay.
But people don't like aoe stun where the other TEAMMEMBERS have to do something for it to be good because the warrior themself LITERALLY can not do anything off of it.

Try it out yourself.
The stun is only for support on warrior, try to move and do much of anything before the target you stunned can move again (and is smart enough to literally just go away from you too and not just stand around and eat it).
You have the power to do so.
Try it on a dummy, challange somebody to a duel to try it out.
That is why it's only 2 second and proccs before they even reach you.