Compiled SAM threads against 6.1 changes / Kaiten removal

[Ruminous]

Wow, I expected nothing and somehow they still managed to disappoint. I'm impressed at how unimpressive the SAM changes are. This level of mediocrity takes true effort to achieve.

I don't call buffs to wet farts mediocrity. They weren't even trying. Can't say I was shocked they'd meet my expectations though. I set that bar on the floor and oh boy they cleared it.

But hey, at least button bloat as a problem was resolved.. Oh wait, they added the mirage dive button back for dragoons, didn't they? An ability they actually could remove and the class would see no real change regardless? Worthless idiots. Their balance devs are 100% not worth what they're being paid.

[Beddict]

Messing with Mirage Dive actually did screw with DRG. When Patch 6.1 dropped, there was no delay between High Jump and Mirage Dive which made it possible to accidentally queue up Mirage Dive and possibly mess with their Eyes and thus their burst phase. That's obviously not good so SE decided to add in a short delay to prevent accidental double weaving. Except that delay also made it possible to screw up their Eyes. An example there is in Dragonsong Ultimate where DRG had just enough time to get in two High Jumps between the two Trios in Thordan I, but the delay increased the risk of missing the second Mirage Dive as Thordan jumped away. Missing Mirage Dive meant one less Eye which meant their burst phase was screwed. Reverting it back to pre-6.1 does reintroduce a button, but it fixes both issues. No risk of accidentally buffering a Mirage Dive when you don't want to, and if you do want to immediately Mirage Dive there's no longer a delay.

The Job Design Team is still absolutely stealing pay checks though, and SE's complete lack of acknowledgement on SAM is bullshit. It's fucking embarrassing to see them trying to sweep this shit under the rug, and their promised explanations are predictably garbage. The DRG bit up above is a good example since there's a solid reason to revert the change but rather than actually explain it, they just said "I dunno, feedback, figure it out". Yoshi-P better have some good explanations in the Patch Note reading because right now he and his team are looking incompetent as shit when it comes to Job Design.

[Ruminous]

Messing with Mirage Dive actually did screw with DRG. When Patch 6.1 dropped, there was no delay between High Jump and Mirage Dive which made it possible to accidentally queue up Mirage Dive and possibly mess with their Eyes and thus their burst phase. That's obviously not good so SE decided to add in a short delay to prevent accidental double weaving. Except that delay also made it possible to screw up their Eyes. An example there is in Dragonsong Ultimate where DRG had just enough time to get in two High Jumps between the two Trios in Thordan I, but the delay increased the risk of missing the second Mirage Dive as Thordan jumped away. Missing Mirage Dive meant one less Eye which meant their burst phase was screwed. Reverting it back to pre-6.1 does reintroduce a button, but it fixes both issues. No risk of accidentally buffering a Mirage Dive when you don't want to, and if you do want to immediately Mirage Dive there's no longer a delay.

The Job Design Team is still absolutely stealing pay checks though, and SE's complete lack of acknowledgement on SAM is bullshit. It's fucking embarrassing to see them trying to sweep this shit under the rug, and their promised explanations are predictably garbage. The DRG bit up above is a good example since there's a solid reason to revert the change but rather than actually explain it, they just said "I dunno, feedback, figure it out". Yoshi-P better have some good explanations in the Patch Note reading because right he and his team are looking incompetent as shit when it comes to Job Design.

They could literally remove mirage dive as an ability and tie the life gain into high jump, the class would literally see no change. If the (laughable) potency was a thing, then put it into geirskogul or stardiver. The fact that they scream "BUTTON BLOAT IS A PROBLEM!" and mirage dive as an ability exists, they really don't know what their problems with bloat are and are just saying things because reasons.

[Faulko]

Dang, I was really hoping for something more. These patch notes are depressing. The changes to crit better be significant, I’m sick of wet noodle Midare’s.

[Hezhi]

The backlash for their unwarranted changes was universally hated, I wished to see at least an explanation. They get to keep burying their heads in the sand while every player who cared about SAM either feels let down or left already. Talk about a job well done.

[Amh_Wilzuun]

Remember when SAM was one of the most consistently popular jobs? You couldn't go one alliance raid without seeing 4 of them. Now reaper/DRG are the ones I see more. I feel like there HAS to be data showing this somewhere at their studio.

[Quor]

Remember when SAM was one of the most consistently popular jobs? You couldn't go one alliance raid without seeing 4 of them. No reaper/DRG are the ones I see more. I feel like there HAS to be data showing this somewhere at their studio.

Probably? The PVP SAM experience is so universally awesome that, unless they have some kind of filtering in place, they'll likely see no real change in SAM numbers. I'll be the first to say that SAM in PVP is a riot in the best sense of the word. The cynic in me thinks they introduced the PVP changes when they did specifically because they suspected that the PVE changes for SAM might not be well-received. Then they could claim "oh SAM numbers didn't change" or that they even went up, but it would all be on the back of the PVP numbers and not the PVE ones. It would make sense for them to have some kind of metric that differentiates content but you know how it is, small indie company and all that.

[Stasya]

Dang, I was really hoping for something more. These patch notes are depressing. The changes to crit better be significant, I’m sick of wet noodle Midare’s.

They cant be big or cant be stackable because otherwise if sam doesnt have 10+ classes with crit buffs in party they will lose in damage vs other sams. I predict it to be mediocre flat 3-5% buff and multiple sources doesnt stack.

Same goes to WAR aswell unless SE wanted this patch to be crit meta with WAR and SAM everywhere.

[Amh_Wilzuun]

Perhaps they can at least filter between PVP, Raids, and dungeons and the like. I imagine Monk and Machinist got their reworks in the past due to the low player counts those jobs were known for which they would have had data on. From what I've noticed they do reworks for these two reasons:

A: The job is unpopular (Monk EW rework, Machinist ShB rework)

B: "We don't know how to design for this job from here on"/This job has some old jank: (EW Summoner, 7.0 Dragoon?)

[CelestiCer]

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