Thread: 6.1 PvP: Amazing!!

Originally Posted by imcrazyd

CC is way unbalanced and needs to have the same party structure on each team. I understand why they removed required roles, but it's a negative impact on the matches themselves. If you have 4 dps on one team and only 2 on the other the latter team always gets ripped to shreds no matter what makes up the party after it. It could be fun, but at the moment it's not.

The concept of roles should just go away in pvp honestly and that is what I thought they were going to do when they said there would be no role restrictions. Granted they "sort of" did that, but there's still flavor to tanks and healers that probably shouldn't exist.

Originally Posted by Kranel_San

I know many may not like what I'm going to say but, they should remove crowd control completely.

No one would ever die...

Originally Posted by Ransu

No one would ever die...

That's extremely untrue as people's HP pools are much more finite then they were prior to the revamp due to healing being on cooldowns or tied to your limited MP pool.

It arguably makes people live longer much of the time as the CC spam is buying more time for their heals to come off cooldown or in more extreme cases even permitting you to get a potion off.

Originally Posted by KageTokage

That's extremely untrue as people's HP pools are much more finite then they were prior to the revamp due to healing being on cooldowns or tied to your limited MP pool.

It arguably makes people live longer much of the time as the CC spam is buying more time for their heals to come off cooldown or in more extreme cases even permitting you to get a potion off.

Everyone has a self heal and many jobs have skills that also heal. Sage for example without CC would basically never die. Heck even now I only die once or twice a match with all the CC.

Outside of White Mage making me want to commit war crimes, I'd say it's better than feast. Also, I like how all the jobs are more unique than in PvE. Volcano map is the best, as leveraging stage hazards in a strategic manner is fun.

I really enjoy playing as WAR for CC. Just reached Platinum 4 and it's so unga bunga!

ME SMASH, ME HAPPY!

I have a lot to say on this subject! I have been playing the PvP nonstop, and in the process I have come to a few realizations, sadly I can only say 3,000 characters per post, so it'll be broken up a bit.



So, I really like the start of these reworks, but there are some conceptual issues that make it a bit difficult to consistently enjoy. I'll mostly be talking about Crystal Conflict during this:

So, I was hooked on the new PvP, I felt like it was making the steps required to make FFXIV PvP actually positively talked about, there are some flaws, but I don't think they're unsolvable, and if they ARE solved, we could be looking at something special here, so I'm going to go down a list in bullet point style to make it easier to read, and I want to see if maybe everyone can come together and reach common ground on some changes:


First up- Crowd Control: Purify is a good start to fixing the problems of players being stuck in situations without an escape, most MOBA games have Cleanse options in them for this very reason, but Purify sadly is not enough it seems. Certain Class Combos can severely inhibit your ability to... well, play at all, and that's downright not fun. I understand it's not fun to have someone wiggle out of a stun that you specifically put on them, so here's what I think might help ease this issue a bit (programming challenge aside):

I think they should add what is known in fighting games as "staling" a move eventually goes stale if it used multiple times, losing potency. Like the mitigation that we had before in PvP, I think introducing another mechanic to prevent constant Crowd Control chains is not only a good idea, but a requirement to keep players engaged. As it stands, AST, WAR, RDM/BRD as a combination, can prevent you from being allowed to even hit a button, for an unreasonable amount of time. Silence stopping your ability to, well use an ability, and the stuns of WAR, following the AoE Slows into Binds of AST, while you're silenced is downright miserable. You can't do anything, and nobody likes that.

So, I think that stuns should lose efficiency the more a player is exposed to them, just like in PvE how you can't CC Chain Mobs repeatedly, Players should have the same luxury. How they tune it is important, but I think it is a serious issue that needs fixing.

-Next is Matchmaking: as it stands, there is what seems to be almost NO Matchmaking for Crystal Conflict, which means you don't have an even fight, even in Ranked. The enemy could have 3 tanks, and 2 DPS, your team could have ALL DPS, for a "Ranked" mode, this is inconceivable, I don't need to explain this one more, I think this NEEDS to be changed.

-Next is Job Balancing: Not all jobs are created equal, this is a new revision, so of course they didn't get EVERYTHING on their first try, but I do want to repeat: This is a GOOD STEP for PvP, it feels a lot more engaging, and if the momentum continues this could become something great. I digress: As it stands, the balancing is sort of unfavorable for certain classes, while some have really troublesome exploits (WHM infinite heal exploit for example). To keep it somewhat short I'll just say, these are the classes that I feel are UNDER powered, and they need a double check, and then I'll say ones that I think need to be detuned:

MNK and DNC, both have severe damage issues, this is just a math problem. MNK you have to work twice as hard as a SAM for your dmg burst, and said burst is so weak in comparison, that you shouldn't have done it in the first place, their LB and final hit of their combo need a damage retune, because I have been hit by 3 MNK LBs without a PLD or anything near me, and survived, that's a huge problem.

GNB is a kinda confusing class to pin down, when it comes to where it is balance wise. I personally think Solid Barrel is... useless? Mainly because Brutal Shell does not heal you, and Gnashing Fang is up often enough that you will always use it. I think they should make Solid Barrel Combo's Brutal Shell heal you, for, around like 8,000 potency maybe? let me know if that sounds unfair. Then tune Gnashing Fangs damage UP a LITTLE BIT, and make the Cooldown longer, like around 40 seconds maybe. Just so the GNB has a reason to USE Solid Barrel, because right now, they don't. Not to mention, removal of Cartridges, makes GNB no different from PLD. PLD goes in, their regular combo is replaced with an equally damaging strike as Burst Strike (not counting Continuation but that itself is not able to justify the next part) which is the fact that PLD HEALS from said Burst Strike Equivalent.

So, GNBs Burst Strike is awkward to use, because you can't hang onto it for very long, and enemies are quite mobile, sometimes you can't chase them, and even if they are OOM (which means they're out of heals) it's not worth it, because Burst Strike does not do enough dmg to make up for rushing within that 10s.

Moving on to OVER tunes.

WHM: infinite heal exploit, need I say more, but they're already working on that I'd assume. I personally think that you should NOT be able to be stunned while Polymorphed as well. Why do I say this? Well, on certain maps like The Volcanic Heart, there are stage hazards, that require either movement, or the use of Guard. Now, Movement is possible when Polymorphed, but it no longer is, if you are Bound, or Stunned. This is an issue, because Polymorph and VARIOUS stuns are up quite frequently, making you an easy pick in some really frustrating situations.

TLDR: Polymorphed players should not be able to be stunned, slowed I think is okay, because at least they CAN move, just less.

MCH: Here's one I have played a lot. Now, one could argue this is "smart" to do, but I find it sort of unfair potentially? Wildfire requires you fire 3 abilities into an enemy, for an immediate detonation. Your Scattershot counts as 2 abilities if you're hitting 1 target. Scattershot also puts your target into a state of KNOCKBACK, which means they can't guard against your Wildfire, unless they expect you to Scattershot them, which... I have basically never seen. This means you're locked into unblockable damage, and quite a lot of it.

Guarding their LB is somewhat inconsistent as well. I've put my Guard up the second the reticle was on me, even before when I've seen them prep the Sniper, but sometimes Marksman's Spite still lands through the Guard? While a preemptive Guard that they fall into, normally is fine- this never happens in higher ranks of CC.

TLDR on that: Maybe increase Marksman's Spite's cast time, or make Guard become "active" sooner.

DRG! I'll keep this short, I don't have much on this: Their LB is nearly impossible to detect in some cases, I have had DRGs LB from spawn, and ride down to the Crystal, wiping an entire team, and getting a game winning push off of it. I don't find that fair, as in all 3 instances, the teams could NOT detect the LB, meaning they had no chance to defend against it. Particles maybe need to be a bit brighter, or maybe an audio cue? idk let me know what you think about that.


Okay! I've said most of the things that I can think of that are in my eyes actionable flaws, some things are up to preference, but I really do hope the team continues to work on PvP, and I hope they really do read what people are saying, because I think eventually we'll land in a spot where PvP is actually fun and engaging for all players.

Let me know what you think, I'm not the only one that plays, and I'm sure there are class issues I have missed. I truly do want the best for the PvP, I've really enjoyed it despite these flaws, but I want to be able to confidently say to other players, that they should try it, and that it DOES work for all classes.

Originally Posted by Dinksta

I have a lot to say on this subject! I have been playing the PvP nonstop, and in the process I have come to a few realizations, sadly I can only say 3,000 characters per post, so it'll be broken up a bit.



So, I really like the start of these reworks, but there are some conceptual issues that make it a bit difficult to consistently enjoy. I'll mostly be talking about Crystal Conflict during this:

So, I was hooked on the new PvP, I felt like it was making the steps required to make FFXIV PvP actually positively talked about, there are some flaws, but I don't think they're unsolvable, and if they ARE solved, we could be looking at something special here, so I'm going to go down a list in bullet point style to make it easier to read, and I want to see if maybe everyone can come together and reach common ground on some changes:


First up- Crowd Control: Purify is a good start to fixing the problems of players being stuck in situations without an escape, most MOBA games have Cleanse options in them for this very reason, but Purify sadly is not enough it seems. Certain Class Combos can severely inhibit your ability to... well, play at all, and that's downright not fun.

Purify should work on everything and should give a longer immunity time. I have zero problems with crowd control, but I dislike that purify isn't a straight cleanse and doesn't work on certain things.