Trick Attack

[RyuDragnier]

Question, does this actually change the NIN rotation, or is it still the same? If the rotation doesn't change, then I personally don't see the issue at all. I mean it's not like it's being removed from the game or your rotation is changing again (like it did at Savage's start this year).

[aloneatsea]

Question, does this actually change the NIN rotation, or is it still the same? If the rotation doesn't change, then I personally don't see the issue at all. I mean it's not like it's being removed from the game or your rotation is changing again (like it did at Savage's start this year).

We don't have enough information to definitely say yes or no, but assuming Trick Attack stays the exact same aside from no longer being a party buff, then yes, it would change the rotation.
Mug's position would likely need to be adjusted to be double-weaved with Trick Attack, which opens up a whole extra can of worms about when the appropriate time to pop Bunshin in your opener is.


That said, they might also adjust where we get +40 Ninki, too. I would say it is safe to assume that the Ninja rotation will be changing for the third time this expansion.

[Theihe]

Even if the ninja did the same dps as monk they would still fall short in utility. Making them a worse choice to bring to an ultimate. Not to mention that all ninjas will be relearning their rotation if there's any ninjas left in 6.1.

And who knows what the increased personal contrabution is, we don't know the numbers right now it could be high or it could be low. It could be that they will reduce potencies on ninjas skills to compensate for trick being a personal buff. No one knows at the moment. All I know is that if the ninja has the same dps as the monk it falls short in every single way.

Mantra is not the end all be all of ultimate content- since all the content in the game is designed around being cleared by all jobs - utility will never be the end all be all.

We'll see how the changes turn out, but I'm quite frankly very hopeful

[aloneatsea]

Mantra is not the end all be all of ultimate content- since all the content in the game is designed around being cleared by all jobs - utility will never be the end all be all.

We'll see how the changes turn out, but I'm quite frankly very hopeful

I might be misunderstanding, but I believe the point he's making is also somewhat along the lines of 'what makes Ninja special, relative to other melee jobs?'. Before these changes, you would obviously say Trick being on a 1 minute timer. After these changes, what makes Ninja distinct from Monk, or Reaper? I can't think of anything. If I were playing another role alongside a Ninja, how I'm thinking about playing my job is now exactly the same as if I were a Monk or Reaper. Dump burst in 2min party buffs, and then ignore for the rest of the fight.

[dadong]

I don't know about being hopeful, Ninjas been put through the ringer in EW and no one knows what the devs are trying to make ninja to be.

[Manofpassion]

This is the dumbest thing honestly. If they were gonna make this change, do it on ew release, the first time, or the second time. The fact it takes them 3 changes to figure out what their plan for ninja is kinda shows that the ninja dev team is running around like headless chickens. Can't wait for the 4th change where they remove mudras, then the 5th change that makes ninja a physical ranged. For one of the most successful mmos ever, i don't think expecting the dev team to have a coherent plan for a class is too much. Of course, square Enix is a small indie company afterall.

[Theihe]

I might be misunderstanding, but I believe the point he's making is also somewhat along the lines of 'what makes Ninja special, relative to other melee jobs?'. Before these changes, you would obviously say Trick being on a 1 minute timer. After these changes, what makes Ninja distinct from Monk, or Reaper? I can't think of anything. If I were playing another role alongside a Ninja, how I'm thinking about playing my job is now exactly the same as if I were a Monk or Reaper. Dump burst in 2min party buffs, and then ignore for the rest of the fight.

In my opinion there needs to be a distinction between "how it feels to play alongside NIN" and "how it feels to play NIN". These changes seem like they won't have any real impact on how the job actually feels to play. And when it comes to "how it feels to play alongside X" I would always de-prioritize such an aspect when it comes to adjusting X.

Your previous comment about how it might change the Mug placement - I don't think it will actually have that big of an impact. It would be enough to make Mug's duration 20 sec and our rotation will stay virtually the same, the only minor change being that Mug will need to be kept on cooldown as opposed to allowing it to drift to manipulate Ninki generation. And even if Mug is 15 sec we would most likely have to use it on the same spot anyways.

But we'll see, atleast for me personally I cannot see why people are losing their marbles

[Chopstix]

If you bothered to actually read what they said instead of hot posting, you'd realize they aren't removing it, they are just moving the party damage increase to Mug, and making Trick Attack a personal damage increase.

If u bothered to read the OP ud realise they r talking about trick in the odd minute bursts that a lot of jobs can contribute to.

[Manofpassion]

I wish I could be optimistic and believe that the dev team will make mug 20 secs so our rotation won't be too affected. But considering it took them 7 years to remedy living dead, and still not fix blood weapon, I must say I don't have much faith. This is the dev team that thought 6 gapclosers in a row would be a fun addition to ninjas kit afterall.

[dadong]

In my opinion there needs to be a distinction between "how it feels to play alongside NIN" and "how it feels to play NIN". These changes seem like they won't have any real impact on how the job actually feels to play. And when it comes to "how it feels to play alongside X" I would always de-prioritize such an aspect when it comes to adjusting X.

It's simply because ninja has always been a "how it feels to play alongside NIN" job and now it's having and identity crisis. you can see why people are losing their marbles