Sage suggestions

[HisShadowX]

I want to say. I haven't been with the game all that long, about a year and a half I think. I came from World of Warcraft a few months before Blizzard started to reap what they had sown there, fleeing a toxic community, bad writing, over homogenization of roles/classes and an overall dumb down of the game.
The game was great. Then...Blizzard started trying to make it fit more people, started homogenizing the classes, started dumbing things down until we lost our trees altogether

I am watching, listening and reading here...and I am seeing alarmingly, many of the same complaints coming from long time players of FFXIV that I watched in the forums of World of Warcraft back toward the end of Wrath of the Lich King...when Blizzard started really homogenizing things and dumbing their game down. I just want to drop that observation here now...that Square Enix needs to start listening, because this is just about Deja Vu for me and I don't like seeing it here for the game I've come to love and call home.

FFXIV is so much better written and plays so well compared to the game I left. I beg of the Devs, don't dumb your game down, don't homogenize your jobs...don't walk the same path Blizzard did.

You do realize Wrath of the Lich King was when WoW was at it's peak it gave everyone but the hardcore minority what it wanted. DKP Guilds were shamed to the point where they were required to list they were a DKP Guild as a Scarlet Letter so people knew to avoid those evil people or they knew what they were getting into. Ghostcrawler hated the fact Wrath was easy and tried to make the end of Wrath harder. I remember when dual speccing was announced to be a raid mechanic which would cost gold and summon stones and require a raid to do. Thankfully that did not happen but...

He got his wish with CATA and then thats when everyone started leaving when ghostcrawler made his infamous, 'WoW, Dungeons are Hard' https://worldofwarcraft.com/en-us/ne...geons-are-hard

Then of course the suits demanded he make the game easy again with the next expansion so what does he do? He makes the joke race real with a disney expansion and then everyone started leaving in droves who held on after the game was made harder and Ghostcrawler resigns.

Those who stayed on were the Hardcore Minority and more and more features in WoW become grinding to appease its user base but like Everquest or FFXI eventually the hardcore minority gets lonely in their ghost town servers and go to popular ones and demand they become harder. Being more like Wrath of the Lich King is a good thing. FFXIV 1.0 was built for the hardcore minority and it failed and they had to destroy and rebuild the entire game because the game was not profitable because it appeased the hardcore minority which is not profitable.

If they make the game harder like you suggest then like CATA the game would go downhill fast but this game already experienced that but the question is would the repeat the errors of redesigning the game to appease you people again?

[Hellebore_Ghrian]

I think you miss the whole point.

It's not about difficulty or harder content.

It's about classes having identity, avoiding dumbing down and don't go further in homogenization.

Something can be easy without being dumb.

[Allegor]

An aoe kardia effect would be awesome, and I'd agree it'd be nice if the job leaned more on the shielding aspect, instead of regens, but I'm fairly certain that was done mostly so it could be paired up with SCH without much issues - when I'm paired with one in DF, I just play pretend to be a WHM and never touch E diagnosis/prognosis

[ty_taurus]

An aoe kardia effect would be awesome, and I'd agree it'd be nice if the job leaned more on the shielding aspect, instead of regens, but I'm fairly certain that was done mostly so it could be paired up with SCH without much issues - when I'm paired with one in DF, I just play pretend to be a WHM and never touch E diagnosis/prognosis

I mean I never touch Diagnosis/Prognosis anyway unless it's prepull or a phase change.

[Tobias_Azuryon]

I've been playing SGE and GNB interchangeably hardcore since EW and feel SGE is pretty much great in almost all its execution.

It would be nice if Taurochole would be a shield instead of a heal to have better synergy with the 10% damage reduction

Well it works with SGE because the goal is to pop the taurochole to recover from damage, and then use dosis to keep filling it back up while the mitigation or regen from another skill helps fill them back up(and not to clash with Adlo)

No one can (or should) be able to instantly pre-emptively negate a buster without a GCD imo. I don't know anyone who really can. Besides if a buster is coming in a krasis + zoe + e.diag if you're REALLY worried can cover most anything even if the tank refuses to mit for the buster. Especially if it crits, I can hit for almost a whole healthbar half the time.

But for recovery the choles are amazing because you dosis > dosis > Tankbuster > Taurochole > Tank gets a big heal and mitigation > takes less damage as you use more dosis. It's actually a really well thought out mechanic imo that feeds into the dosis/passive heal if you're staying on top of it.

It's not really a matter of healing or DPSing. If you've burned thru your oGCDs and have to GCD heal, you're much harder pressed as a SGE than on WHM/SCH/AST to actually make it thru unscathed. Your GCD heals are already weaker to losing that Kardia regen on top just makes a bad situation worse. It's mostly just to help out bad SGEs because I'm tired of dying on my DRK on the last pull of Tower of Zot

I think a big thing people constantly forget about is pepsis. In the new 24 man alone due to the wipes and constant deaths I've used pepsis more in that fight than ever before because it just makes sense. I can move, aoe shield, pop shield, pop shield can crit(!), and shield again to cover most if not all mechanics in the fight/s.

The goal (for me) with SGE is just to keep undercapped by one on addersgall and use holos physis and kerachole to mitigate 80% of the remaining damage. Pan/Haima as well due to lack of any further stacking after EX1 and EX2 are bonkers heals/shields that you can basically just pop off with whenever you want. SGE is not wanting for heals by a long shot.
If you're still levelling (assuming based on the Zot comment) I'm wondering why you're dying if the DRK is doing his job? Because of the short CD the goal is to just alternate your mit over and over. First pull Kerachole and Sorteria, Second pull Taurochole and Physis, and kerachole is on such a short cooldown and at level 78+ has a regen effect. Kerachole can do most the job passively but even if you do burn through your gall somehow, you can still not Eukrasia and just do the regular aoe heal if needed (which is only 100 potency less than medica) or use the aforementioned e.prog + Pepsis shatter.

Don't sleep on Pepsi Cola. -nod-

[Rein_eon_Osborne]

If you've burned thru your oGCDs and have to GCD heal, you're much harder pressed as a SGE than on WHM/SCH/AST to actually make it thru unscathed. Your GCD heals are already weaker to losing that Kardia regen on top just makes a bad situation worse. It's mostly just to help out bad SGEs because I'm tired of dying on my DRK on the last pull of Tower of Zot

Can confirm this.

On the hands of inexperienced players who plays a SGE (and SCH too to slightly lesser extent), in such dire situations they're pretty much gambling on whether their GCD shield criticals or not. That is, IF the SGE even tries to use E.Diagnosis. If for whatever reason they came to conclusion that spamming Diagnosis is a better option in that case, you, as a DRK, are doomed lol.

I'm wondering why you're dying if the DRK is doing his job?

The person you're replying IS the DRK. The underperforming player is the SGE they got paired with in their story, just letting you know.

Don't sleep on Pepsi Cola. -nod-

I still personally think Pepsis is such an underwhelming option SGE have. It's 'enough' at best... but between Ixochole, Kerachole, Physis II, Holos, Panhaima, and Zoe+Pneuma, those are bonker-degree of free healing they can throw out before having to touch the Pepsi. Across my quite limited time dabbling with SGE (I play other 3 more often), I could probably name the amount of times I used Pepsis in emergencies in two hands. More often than not, waiting a few more seconds to wait for that Physis II + Ixochole are just as viable, albeit more efficient than doing the former.

But maybe I need more clown fiesta parties to have more say... lol.

[LeonKeyh]

Well it works with SGE because the goal is to pop the taurochole to recover from damage, and then use dosis to keep filling it back up while the mitigation or regen from another skill helps fill them back up(and not to clash with Adlo)

No one can (or should) be able to instantly pre-emptively negate a buster without a GCD imo. I don't know anyone who really can. Besides if a buster is coming in a krasis + zoe + e.diag if you're REALLY worried can cover most anything even if the tank refuses to mit for the buster. Especially if it crits, I can hit for almost a whole healthbar half the time.

But for recovery the choles are amazing because you dosis > dosis > Tankbuster > Taurochole > Tank gets a big heal and mitigation > takes less damage as you use more dosis. It's actually a really well thought out mechanic imo that feeds into the dosis/passive heal if you're staying on top of it.

Agree on all points, someone just brought it up and I thought that it would be "cool", but you're right. I had thought that it would be similar to Divine Benison/Celestial Intersection in terms of shielding with an OGCD, but I understand your points.

[IceBlueNinja]

Imo people who play dark cant be mad at sch or sge. Even the experienced of us cant easy keep up on big pulls with dark. easy as ast or whm and thats more a dark issue with their lack of defensive options compared to the other 3 tanks. Tbh sometimes I will just leave if I get dark as tank if certain type of dungeons. Cant blame the player all time its just bad design. When am with warrior and pld I press 0 to 1 heal. 1 or 2. dark is my entire kit and they still oops over as sage. Now ast and whm no issue cause holy stun does ease mass pressure and as well ed and lp can be a miracle

[IceBlueNinja]

Can confirm this.

On the hands of inexperienced players who plays a SGE (and SCH too to slightly lesser extent), in such dire situations they're pretty much gambling on whether their GCD shield criticals or not. That is, IF the SGE even tries to use E.Diagnosis. If for whatever reason they came to conclusion that spamming Diagnosis is a better option in that case, you, as a DRK, are doomed lol.



The person you're replying IS the DRK. The underperforming player is the SGE they got paired with in their story, just letting you know.



I still personally think Pepsis is such an underwhelming option SGE have. It's 'enough' at best... but between Ixochole, Kerachole, Physis II, Holos, Panhaima, and Zoe+Pneuma, those are bonker-degree of free healing they can throw out before having to touch the Pepsi. Across my quite limited time dabbling with SGE (I play other 3 more often), I could probably name the amount of times I used Pepsis in emergencies in two hands. More often than not, waiting a few more seconds to wait for that Physis II + Ixochole are just as viable, albeit more efficient than doing the former.

But maybe I need more clown fiesta parties to have more say... lol.

Agreed I hardly or forget pepsi alot what you state is enough to handle mass damage. Pepsi should be reworked to be DT. one thing both sge and sch still fails to me vs old noct stance is crummy party shields. the single ones is beastly and chunky on crits but party ews. Miss aspect noct + celestial shield party stack least pani and hami though also burst heals so it makes up for something compared to succor.

[Tobias_Azuryon]

The person you're replying IS the DRK. The underperforming player is the SGE they got paired with in their story, just letting you know.

Ah apologies my reading comprehension is apparently garbage and I misunderstood the phrasing.

IN regards to the rest I don't feel like people understand that you don't HAVE To be allergic to GCDs to still do good dps. I'm still usually top dps of healers minus when the other(s) have BiS/Savage Gear, despite using diag and prog. -shrug-

If even a sliver of shield is there or if a little duration is left you can get easy extra heals and I've had plenty of times where I've recovered while solo healing in the 24 man because of Pepsis being a free instant 350 pot heal that can crit.

Aside from Savage (Which this is the first expac I've done savage healing so my experience is admittedly limited) SGE has no issues with its kit in 99% of the content.

Imo people who play dark cant be mad at sch or sge.

Not sure I agree with this take. While yeah if you're under geared it can be really difficult it's not any "more" difficult than SCH's recovery options in the same scenario imo. Sorteria + choles tends to do enough usually, but I also keep up with gear (except for BiS) so maybe that's where my perspective is skewed somewhat?

That's not meant to be a jab but higher ilevel will obviously have an effect on my interactions with healing in general.

one thing both sge and sch still fails to me vs old noct stance is crummy party shields.

Zoe + Aoe Shield or Zoe + Shield while Physis is active is great. I've created some meaty shields in current content there. But again it might be gear related that's skewing my perspective.

*EDITED*