Job action combos one button

[ArcaviusGreyashe]

I love you, Shurrikhan, and everything you've said, but I'd just like to add something

Who in this thread has even insinuated pressing 123 instead of 111 is harder?

I know it isn't your argument, but the fact is : it is. For many people out there. There are loads of people in this thread that argued that concatenated combos would be dumbing down the game, and everybody, including you, agrees it wouldn't make it easier for them to use those. But there are people out there that have arthritis, psychomotricity issues, and whatnot. The argument over "if it would be more comfortable for the average joe" is already a mess because you're all pretending you'll be forced to play that way, or, and I don't know what's less probable, that you'll quit if it is implemented, but there are people out there that need it to play harder content.

Therefore, it should be implemented, whatever you think about it.

[Amon-ster]

Why having the OPTION to simplify linear combos should be available

That would be okay if this were a single player game, but it isn't. The thing about "optional" things in MMOs is that they eventually become so dominant that it becomes less of an option and more of a community standard for both players and developers. Players optimize the fun out of video games, and then enforce that standard onto others. It'll just become "meta" to condense all your buttons down to 1 button because it'll cut down on potential errors as you're unlikely to break your combo or to make a mistake. While it's very easy to say "don't listen to the meta, just play what you want" the fact of the matter is that an MMO is a social game with a social community, despite Yoshi's best efforts to make this a single player JRPG. What becomes the community meta will exert pressure on others to conform, either subtly by just seeing a lot of people say that it makes the game much easier and cuts down on mistakes, or directly by being told "How'd you break your combo? Are you not using the button condenser?"

[Doc_Seraph]

Call them Kupo Combos ...lol jk

[Kandraxx]

The thing you’re looking for is already there ‘pcombo’ addon, it’s what makes this game playable.

It also has intelligent functions, like baking the continuation moves from GNB into the “main button”. <3

[Izar_Chillen]

Im glad they changed the GNB gnashing cartridge combo into a single button repeated action , it feels less bloaty , naturally, and much better on the fingers to play using the same keybinds as my other tanks now that its saved me 2 hot bar slots

I just wish the tanks didnt have the slow as 2.49 recast on most of it skills it feels so dated and clunky despite enjoying the tanks a lot , but that's another topic entirely

[Absurdity]

Im glad they changed the GNB gnashing cartridge combo into a single button repeated action , it feels less bloaty , naturally, and much better on the fingers to play using the same keybinds as my other tanks now that its saved me 2 hot bar slots

I just wish the tanks didnt have the slow as 2.49 recast on most of it skills it feels so dated and clunky despite enjoying the tanks a lot , but that's another topic entirely

That change at the same time made it harder to keep track of which ability you're at in your Gnashing Fang combo.



2.5 is only the base GCD, Skill Speed reduces it. The 2.5 second GCD exists because you have oGCDs to weave in-between those 2.5 seconds and double weaving oGCDs is actually mandatory on GnB if you want to play it at even just a competent level. Anything below 2 seconds makes it basically impossible to double weave.

[Izar_Chillen]

That change at the same time made it harder to keep track of which ability you're at in your Gnashing Fang combo.

I dont find it hard to remember much as it press the button x3 till the combo is over either the default triple or the ShB continuation combo weave so for me i press Shift+D (Gnashing) X3 or Shift_D >Shift+SPACEBAR(Continuation rip tear gouge) in sequnce 3 times


am i missing some weave thing or its that the 90 skill i havnt got yet?

[LisSquid]

I still think combos should only exist on jobs that have some fluidy/mesh with them (monk is a prime example. I'd never ask to remove monk combos because the monk job IS its combos). What I'd rather have are more choices on spenders. If you spent less time having to build resources (in a combo) and could spend more time making intelligent decisions on what to use with said resource then the 1-2-3 in jobs like RPR would feel less like deadair time.

I am two drinks in, but monk has combos that feel like they should be there while jobs like RPR have combos because they didn't know how else to fill the space between your spenders.

[Shurrikhan]

The problem with making it optional is it won't stay optional. At least not in a functional sense.... players who dislike combo consolidation... [will] eventually be forced into it as new buttons are added and none are removed.

This presumes that any decrease to present button count would necessitate that new button-consuming actions must fill the then savable spaces. While I wouldn't be opposed to that, it runs contrary to trends since Heavensward, which have usually seen increasingly less depth included per button and have been increasingly less accepting of higher button counts, even to the point of removing actual and more integral depth (e.g., Monk's ability to position once each per stanceless DoT period) to try to remain within a "comfortable" button total.

The dev team isn't going to design a whole system specifically for combo consolidation only to also prune out old abilities.

First, it's not a new system. We've had it since Stormblood.

Second, so what? At worst, those who refuse to consolidate go from, say, some 24 buttons to 27. That's hardly damning to those who like their buttons or consequent finger drift.

Admittedly, though, if this was all left completely to player option, such could require some new design (or, just no longer purposely putting barriers in the way of macro functionality), but that'd also mean that a player could set their GCDs to go 1-2-3 and 1-2-4 as they do Storm's Path or Storm's Eye, respectively, even while not wasting any keys (with, say, Fell Cleave and Decimate simply moving around based on combo progress).

A new system could allow for that "hit different button per step" engagement, while a 1-1-1 or 2-2-2 for each respective combo would, in fact, be a 3-expansion-old system ready for implementation.

So which is it? The system you're complaining about wouldn't have to be developed, while any system that would need development could address your exact concern.

And please don't argue, "they'll be able to add new abilities if they consolidation combos!" Look at Summoner. Just... look at it. They had a new slate to work with; an entirely fresh canvas. Look how many buttons it got. Do you really think they'll give Warrior two full combos or replace the 6-7 buttons Dragoon loses? I guarantee they won't.

Then where is your first argument going? If there's little to no chance of SE filling that space saved with new buttons for those who use that option, how does that "option" break down into a "requirement" over increased button count?

I don't mean to "got ya!" or whatnot here, but it can't be both, so which is our predominant fear -- that (A) jobs will get more complex and thus make the option no longer an option, or (B) that the option will remain as much an option (and simply that, with it becoming more obvious that there are no unique affordances to having those separate buttons for rigid combos, fewer people will feel inclined to favor that bit of extra memory aid over button efficiency and thereby depopularize something you prefer, even if it still remains truly an option)?

[ForteNightshade]

This presumes that any decrease to present button count would necessitate that new button-consuming actions must fill the then savable spaces. While I wouldn't be opposed to that, it runs contrary to trends since Heavensward, which have usually seen increasingly less depth included per button and have been increasingly less accepting of higher button counts, even to the point of removing actual and more integral depth (e.g., Monk's ability to position once each per stanceless DoT period) to try to remain within a "comfortable" button total.

While that may be the case, several jobs already won't gain much space even if combos where consolidated, thus any new additions come 7.0 will start pushing people towards it if implemented. A job like say, Ninja or Gunbreaker aren't saving all that much space. Which means they'll eventually be squeezed into it as new abilities are added over time. Regardless, this is more in response to people who insist if combos were consolidated, they'll suddenly add in new combos for tanks; more DPS for healers and etc. A lot of people who do ask for this often believe it'll pave the way for added depth and not simply less buttons with little else. If it actually led to depth, I'd be more open to it.

First, it's not a new system. We've had it since Stormblood.

Second, so what? At worst, those who refuse to consolidate go from, say, some 24 buttons to 27. That's hardly damning to those who like their buttons or consequent finger drift.

It is for PvP. If the transition were simple enough to move over, I suspect they would have done so already.

As for caring? Well, all the people who dislike combo consolidation. I'll throw that back at you. Who cares if you find 123 pointless? At the end of the day, we're essentially arguing preference.

(A) jobs will get more complex and thus make the option no longer an option, or (B) that the option will remain as much an option (and simply that, with it becoming more obvious that there are no unique affordances to having those separate buttons for rigid combos, fewer people will feel inclined to favor that bit of extra memory aid over button efficiency and thereby depopularize something you prefer, even if it still remains truly an option)?

You neglected a third option where some jobs that are already squeezed even with combo consolidation are inevitably forced into a system they don't want because new buttons are continuously added and now there isn't a reason to prune away any. You're also assuming people are simply unaware combos aren't unique per se and just don't realize they can condensed. Most are. They simply don't like the idea.