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  1. #1
    Player
    Lyth's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2015
    Location
    Meracydia
    Posts
    3,883
    Character
    Lythia Norvaine
    World
    Gilgamesh
    Main Class
    Viper Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Archwizard View Post
    ...
    Like I said earlier, if you were designing the tank jobs from scratch, everything that you're suggesting would be very reasonable. The problem is that the playerbase has expectations of the jobs based off of their prior experiences with them.

    The primary reason why WAR is currently the lifesteal tank is, unfortunately, because it got there first. There was a period in time during early Stormblood where it could have gone either way, and I've asked many of these same questions myself several years back. But now you have players who have been maining WAR for something approaching 10 years now, and there's a community expectation that's built up over time that it's 'supposed' to be good at lifesteal. If you want to know what you're up against, just take a look at the 'Tank healing is too high' thread to see what happens when you try to take away those toys. And from a developer standpoint, why would you want to risk it? You have players that are really happy with the design of the job. If you start tampering with it to make another job look more attractive, then you just end up with two groups of angry players instead of just one.

    I'm likewise not a fan of trying to try to share lifesteal with other tanks. It's dumb enough that PLD now uses vampiric holy magic. Why would you throw yourself into the midst of that competition? I'd personally just like to see DRK develop a unique gameplay style and identity that isn't available on another tank, rather than ending up as a budget WAR just because it's in vogue. And that's the comparison that will invariably be made at the end of the day.

    It doesn't matter either way. I can only point out the practicalities of the issue. Enjoy your homebrew.
    (5)

  2. #2
    Player
    Archwizard's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2019
    Location
    A café at the edge of the universe
    Posts
    1,130
    Character
    Archwizard Drake
    World
    Sargatanas
    Main Class
    Red Mage Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Lyth View Post
    I'm likewise not a fan of trying to try to share lifesteal with other tanks. It's dumb enough that PLD now uses vampiric holy magic. Why would you throw yourself into the midst of that competition? I'd personally just like to see DRK develop a unique gameplay style and identity that isn't available on another tank, rather than ending up as a budget WAR just because it's in vogue. And that's the comparison that will invariably be made at the end of the day.
    So one, this paragraph here gives me the vibe that you wrote off the entire doc without reading it when you saw "life steal" on the OP, because you think WAR should have a monopoly on it – which I would normally write off as an outlandish bad faith interpretation of your statement, if you hadn't gone so far as to heckle PLD for healing with its holy spells. The job that has had self-healing since FF1, but only as a ribbon here because of its DPS cost.
    Or claimed that this would make DRK "budget WAR" when... look at it currently. This isn't in a vacuum of "the only thing I added was more lifesteal."
    And to be honest, the idea that you would throw out any type of lifesteal, regardless of its methodology, only permitting Bloodwhetting purely because "WAR got there first" is exceptionally close-minded.

    Especially when you pull out the one-two of
    The primary reason why WAR is currently the lifesteal tank is, unfortunately, because it got there first. There was a period in time during early Stormblood where it could have gone either way, and I've asked many of these same questions myself several years back.
    ... wherein you demonstrate the malleability of these roles and how they aren't set in stone, regardless of "expectations." It's a very "eat your cake and have it too" argument.
    And as I already explained, DRK has an even longer precedent than WAR does, predating 14, one where people claiming WAR should life-leech would have less of a leg to stand on if a swap was imminent. Meanwhile DRK's current role as a barrier tank comes out of nowhere.
    (1)
    Last edited by Archwizard; 02-20-2022 at 03:12 AM.

  3. #3
    Player
    Luizgazen's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2022
    Posts
    52
    Character
    Casimir Ditasch
    World
    Exodus
    Main Class
    Dark Knight Lv 100
    If DRK were a job available from ARR, it definitely would be the lifesteal tank and WAR the heavy mitigation one, but it werent, so WAR got the lifesteal and PLD the mitigation back then... now DRK magic style of tanking can lend itself to both lifesteal and shielding and since TBN is a thing, that should be the direction they take us.
    A direction i tought right now, quickly at that so there may be some serious flaw in my ideas, would be something like this:

    get a "Brutal Shell"-like shield on our ST and AOE combos, change Dark Missionary to a 15% maxhp shield to the party, Dark Mind to a big shield and increase its cooldown to balance, and turn Oblation into a trait, giving raw mitigation to the shield we make.
    Like this we could keep some light mitigation most of the time so our shields wont break instantly and Dark Missionary would became a very good party utility with a base 10% mit and some shielding, do this and we wouldnt even need much more sustain than Soul Eater and Abyssal Drain, maybe just changing the Dark Arts proc into a heal like the other tank spammables, just have to make sure the Oblation trait won't work with healer shields or it would became too strong.
    (0)