Sundering stuff established in the Q&A

[Rulakir]

I'm definitely in that 80%. I didn't like Hermes at all and I consider Fandaniel the worst, most irritating antagonist in the series. According to discussions on social media I am exactly the type of person who should've understood and sympathized with him too.

I think that the character as was depicted in the game isn't exactly what they had in mind. Ishikawa and Yoshi-P speak of him as being objective/impartial, which based on what we saw of him seems like an odd take. I assume because they're directly involved with the story they know context and nuance that may not have translated well into the game. His character is widely attributed with having mental illness that drove his actions, for example, which they don't address.

I don't know what to make of the character comparison given that their motivations were different, but supposedly this isn't the first time Yoshi-P's been surprised by player reactions to a character or storyline. I also think "mistake" is a bizarre way to describe unleashing something that was Hell bent on destroying all life in the universe too.

[KageTokage]

It is kind of awkward that being the head overseer of Elpis, he should've known the potential dangers of mass-producing an untested concept better then anyone else; even more so one that was capable of harnessing an energy they scarcely understood.

Had he simply sent out one Meteion and seen how it responded to dark emotions before unleashing an entire horde, things probably would've been fine.

[EaraGrace]

I don't know what to make of the character comparison given that their motivations were different, but supposedly this isn't the first time Yoshi-P's been surprised by player reactions to a character or storyline. I also think "mistake" is a bizarre way to describe unleashing something that was Hell bent on destroying all life in the universe too.

In his worst nightmares I don’t think Hermes or Meteion expected the answers they found. I think in that lies the “mistake,” and given what the original intent of Meteions mission was I can’t really say he was wrong or evil for going through with it. Naive and irresponsible? Sure. But that’s not enough to condemn him.

It is kind of awkward that being the head overseer of Elpis, he should've known the potential dangers of mass-producing an untested concept better then anyone else; even more so one that was capable of harnessing an energy they scarcely understood.

Had he simply sent out one Meteion and seen how it responded to dark emotions before unleashing an entire horde, things probably would've been fine.

Based on the side quests in Elpis, the Ancients seem to frequently “create first and ask questions later.” There’s potentially an eldritch beaver infestation that one researcher asks us to ignore, there’s the guy who made Behemoths because he just wanted his creation to be super strong, and then there’s the creator of the Cyclops in Anyder running around throwing monsters at random familiars.

Comes down to hubris I think.

[sidurgu-12]

In his worst nightmares I don’t think Hermes or Meteion expected the answers they found. I think in that lies the “mistake,” and given what the original intent of Meteions mission was I can’t really say he was wrong or evil for going through with it. Naive and irresponsible? Sure. But that’s not enough to condemn him.



Based on the side quests in Elpis, the Ancients seem to frequently “create first and ask questions later.” There’s potentially an eldritch beaver infestation that one researcher asks us to ignore, there’s the guy who made Behemoths because he just wanted his creation to be super strong, and then there’s the creator of the Cyclops in Anyder running around throwing monsters at random familiars.

Comes down to hubris I think.

then theres pandaemonium. how does a monster with a detachable head help the world?

[EaraGrace]

then theres pandaemonium. how does a monster with a detachable head help the world?

Fun party gag!

Until it tries to drown you

[Lyth]

It's not surprising that the writers described Hermes as generally impartial. Hermes was a researcher, and being objective was what he did for a living. He was the one who designed the protocols at Elpis, as well developing as Kairos as a means of reassessing species without killing them off. He was also able to recognize that the Iykaones would be a threat to the ecosystem and act on it, despite deeply regretting the decision. If you'll recall, that was the critical test that Emet used to determine if Hermes would be a suitable candidate to rule the Amaurotians as part of the Convocation. It's easy to fixate on his private moments of emotional expression because they're narratively significant and forget that he was well respected by his peers as a scientist.

It's worth remembering that Hermes' rebellious actions on Elpis were not premeditated. He had no grand aspirations for power, and essentially turned Emet's offer down on two separate occasions. He was a clumsy nerd who got himself stuck in trees. The Meteia themselves were sent out simply to explore space and make contact with other civilizations, and he expected to have positive findings. Pretty much any creation with sufficient free will and intellect is capable of turning on you, regardless of how much 'testing' you do, and there are plenty of risky decisions being made in Pandaemonium under Lahabrea's watch. And after the memory reset, Hermes was oddly enough the most valuable Convocation member of them all, being the one who identified the means to forestall the Final Days. Most of his actions on Elpis were done in the heat of the moment.

Emet completely misjudged him, though, and there was an interesting dynamic between the two. Hermes was no doubt aware that the price of his admission to the Convocation hinged on his ability to demonstrate that he was capable of passing judgement on and executing the Iykaones, which is why he was livid when Emet congratulated him and made him the offer immediately afterwards. Hermes' real frustration was over not being able to be true to himself. And when presented with a similar scenario of turning Meteion in to be terminated so soon afterwards, it's not really all that surprising that he suddenly grew a backbone and stood up to Emet. Everyone has a limit to how far you can push them.

I'd be interested in knowing more detail about his life post-Elpis, though. Amon has been kicking around since the Third Astral Era by virtue of body hopping. That would seem to suggest that Hermes had the option of doing something similar but declined to do so, which would be an interesting reversal of his original stance on the issue.

[KageTokage]

I'd be interested in knowing more detail about his life post-Elpis, though. Amon has been kicking around since the Third Astral Era by virtue of body hopping. That would seem to suggest that Hermes had the option of doing something similar but declined to do so, which would be an interesting reversal of his original stance on the issue.

This reminds me that there's still some specifics about the Ascians that were not really elaborated on, like where the black-masked ones fall in the scheme of things, or how they adopted their body-snatching practices and gained immortality of the soul.

And what exactly does "mastering the gift" entail, as both Elidibus and Zenos put it? As strong as we are, the things our Echo is capable of doing still remain extremely limited compared to that of many we've bested, even the sundered Ascians.

[Tehmon]

Emet completely misjudged him, though, and there was an interesting dynamic between the two. Hermes was no doubt aware that the price of his admission to the Convocation hinged on his ability to demonstrate that he was capable of passing judgement on and executing the Iykaones, which is why he was livid when Emet congratulated him and made him the offer immediately afterwards. Hermes' real frustration was over not being able to be true to himself. And when presented with a similar scenario of turning Meteion in to be terminated so soon afterwards, it's not really all that surprising that he suddenly grew a backbone and stood up to Emet. Everyone has a limit to how far you can push them.

Interesting theory, but I feel like when Emet told Hermes to join the Convocation in that moment, it was less about Emet approving Hermes as the next Fandaniel, but Emet realizing that something bad is going on with Hermes, and his position as the overseer of Elpis might be worsening the situation. Thus taking the seat of Fandaniel being the better alternative at that moment. Of course, Emet wasn't able to fully identify the issue at hand, he admits that he doesn't understand Hermes' reactions, but I think he was in the right that Hermes doesn't belong in Elpis. Too little too late though, as Hermes should've never been allowed to question ancient lifestyle and civilization and their relationship with death as much as he did, or send out undisclosed creations into places ancients couldn't reach. And staying at Elpis, being an overseer no less, probably played a part in both of these things.

[Lyth]

Emet's task is a fairly significant one. If someone gets appointed to the Convocation, that's a lifelong post. It's always significantly easier to get someone in than it is to get them out, and the last thing that you want to be doing is spending the rest of your career working around a prospective colleague who is unreliable or is at odds with you. That's why small, influential groups of people like these tend to become progressively more conservative and homogenous over time (although nepotism is a contributing factor to this as well). Emet genuinely thinks highly of Hermes for his ability to follow through on the decision to eradicate the Iykaones, and directly states as much immediately following the cutscene:

'...I don't know what answer he's searching for, or if it is within our power to give it. But I believe he would make a fine Fandaniel, and that if he rejects us out of hand, we will all be the lesser for it.'

On the subject of soul transference, I think the hint lies in 'Through His Eyes'. The Phoinix demonstrated that a drifting soul burdened with regret could accidentally merge with a Creation to resist the pull of the Underworld. That's effectively the basis for the hemitheos, Zodiark's heart, and body hopping right there. Once Lahabrea saw what happened with the soul hitched on to his Phoinix, he likely would have figured out how to do the rest.

As for the souls themselves, they're not unique entities. They store your memories while you're alive, and then go to the Underworld to be cleansed and used by someone new. Sometimes that process is imperfect and the inheritor of a soul retains memories of a previous life. In Amon's case, Hermes soul had previously been blasted with aether from Kairos, which left the memories from Elpis etched on his soul after being cleansed in the aetheric sea. Normally, you're supposed to use the Convocation job crystals instead to regain your 'lost' memories.

[sidurgu-12]

As for the souls themselves, they're not unique entities. They store your memories while you're alive, and then go to the Underworld to be cleansed and used by someone new. Sometimes that process is imperfect and the inheritor of a soul retains memories of a previous life. In Amon's case, Hermes soul had previously been blasted with aether from Kairos, which left the memories from Elpis etched on his soul after being cleansed in the aetheric sea. Normally, you're supposed to use the Convocation job crystals instead to regain your 'lost' memories.

i know its a jrpg thing but to me this doesn't really mesh well with ffxiv.