Living Dead change idea

[Danelo]

Superbolide provide a true invul. At the very least it can be use to cheese the debuff mechanic while LD can't. Meanwhile your preferred freeze HP version make it better than Superbolide no matter what.

Agreed, no job is perfect, but man, gnb is great. I can actually use my invulnerability/hos(whatever it was renamed)/aroura and be solid. DRK is gimped just by living dead even if it was on par with the rest of the tanks. The exception being if it had WARs current self sustain kit and WD didn’t cleanse automatically after heal requirement was met.

[ForteNightshade]

Superbolide provide a true invul. At the very least it can be use to cheese the debuff mechanic while LD can't. Meanwhile your preferred freeze HP version make it better than Superbolide no matter what.

A true invuln doesn't matter though. Holmgang is objectively better than Hallowed Ground because of its CD. Living Dead would be better if they simply removed the heal component entirely. Even if they made it 25-50%, it'd be better in a raid setting. Which invuln is better largely doesn't matter because people aren't choosing their preferred tank based on invulns. If that were the case Warrior wouldn't have been largely forgotten last expansion, and wouldn't be getting locked out of the meta this tier.

And the whole debuff cheese would likely still apply in my freeze change since freezing your HP wouldn't prevent you from getting debuffs.

[The_User]

Holm is better not only because it have a short recast but also because WAR at present don't need healer intervention.

If GNB don't have Aurora and HOC don't give a heal then Superbolide's quality would suddenly drop.


LD shouldn't have a condition for survival that Dark Knight can't fulfilled by themselves. The same goes for every invul.


Also this :

And the whole debuff cheese would likely still apply in my freeze change since freezing your HP wouldn't prevent you from getting debuffs.

Wraithform: Renders you impervious to healing spells and most attacks. Duration: 10 seconds.

AND

Hallowed Ground : Renders you impervious to most attacks.

Lyth already posted my preferred change but it's essentially the Wraithform equivalent. Once activated, Living Dead freezes your HP. You can neither be healed nor take damage for 10 seconds. .

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It basically grant you the true invul like HG so of course you can still cheese the debuff.

[Lyth]

Invulns only prevent the application of a debuff when they're tied to damage. You'd get the exact same result if you completely negated the damage with TBN as you would if you used Hallowed or Superbolide. When the devs specifically don't want to let you to do this, they just make the debuff apply independently of the damage. We've seen this since Stormblood at the very least, perhaps even earlier. 'Impervious to most attacks' is just the standardized description that the English localization team uses, so I kept it consistent.

[The_User]

Yes, we're talking about cheese the debuff with invul that grant true invul like HG. But saying TBN can do the same doesn't mean that if we make LD a true invul then it can't cheese debuff like HG

[Lyth]

????

I don't understand how this is relevant. Debuffs still apply through Hallowed, Superbolide, and TBN whenever the dev team makes them apply independently of damage received. That should be the universal standard at baseline anyways. The primary advantage of negating damage is that it lowers your healing requirements, which is what a tank with limited self-sustain really needs.

The real question is how you would balance out a 'HP freeze' against Superbolide in terms of recast. They're similar enough in advantages/disadvantages to not justify a difference in recast. You could keep Hallowed at 7 minutes, set Superbolide/Wraith at 6 minutes, and set Holmgang at 5 minutes.

[The_User]

Because make LD freeze HP and negate damage and subsequently negate debuff that apply when taken damage as well will turn LD to HG with a shorter recast time since you can expect both true invul and debuff cheese like when you use HG.

[Zairava]

Because make LD freeze HP and negate damage and subsequently negate debuff that apply when taken damage will turn LD to HG with a shorter recast time since you can expect both true invul and debuff cheese like when you use HG.

Yes, I still don't see how this is an issue, even with LD being currently utter garbage it can still be cheese debuffs so long as you have a whm with benediction ready, the only difference here is the method, and a far better method with a far better invuln. the fact you can't be healed would justify it being on the same 6 minute cooldown as superbolide. if they decided that mechanics couldn't or shouldn't be cheesed this way they would make it that way in the encounter, they need to because invulns exists in the first place.

[The_User]

Do you refer to the current LD? if so I believe at the moment it doesn't negate damage and thus can't prevent debuff that apply when you take a damage from the attack.


The fact that you can't be heal do not always justify the cooldown since you don't need healing when you can freeze your HP when it isn't low. Beside, the low HP before freeze that could happen didn't caused by boss attack during the invul.

[Terhix]

if they decided that mechanics couldn't or shouldn't be cheesed this way they would make it that way in the encounter, they need to because invulns exists in the first place.

The man speaks the truth. Has DRK been so bad for so long that the players have developed a Stockholm Syndrome resulting in an aversion to asking for abilities that actually work and fulfill their purpose? If 2 out of 4 tanks can cheese debuffs with their invulns, making it so that 3 tanks can do it is going to break exactly zero content, how is this even a discussion? If the CD needs to be adjusted, then let the devs adjust the CD.